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Stuttering in VMR9


Kurben

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Hi.

 

I get severe stuttering when using WMR9 in DVBViewer 3.5, when trying overlay it gets smooth but I really want to use WMR9 since it uses the correct video levels and my Overlay is too dark and not as detailed.

 

I am running a ATI 9600 AGP as graphics card with the absolute latest drivers from ATI. The resolution I am using is 1360x768 @ 75hz (PAL) via VGA to my LG plasma 42PM1MA with a native resolution och 1024x768, so I am letting the Monitor/TV scale the Horizontal part. The reason for this is to get a correct aspect ration.

My processor is a P4HT 2.6 ghz with 1gb memory. When watching tv the processor is working at about 20%

 

The codecs I have tested is: Cyberlink PDVD7, Nvidia purevideo, Intervideo Windvd7, Cyberlink DTV.

 

I have also tried several other resolutions, like 1024x768 and 1280x720 same problems always with WMR9.

 

TV card is Twinhan DVB-T PCI and also a Skystar 2 PCI.

 

When watching a DVD thru Windvd7 och Powerdvd 7 I get no stuttering, and I think these are using WMR9? Also when watching tv using Twinhan DTV I get smooth video but that application seems to be using Overlay.

 

Please help or give me suggestions on what to test.

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Could you please try disabling DXVA? Easiest way is for the CyberLink decoder. Go to 'View' -> 'Filters' -> 'CyberLink Video/SP Decoder (PDVD7)' and disable 'Use Hardware Accelerator'. Dunno if it is changed on-the-fly. Probably you have to restart DVBViewer.

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Could you please try disabling DXVA? Easiest way is for the CyberLink decoder. Go to 'View' -> 'Filters' -> 'CyberLink Video/SP Decoder (PDVD7)' and disable 'Use Hardware Accelerator'. Dunno if it is changed on-the-fly. Probably you have to restart DVBViewer.

 

Hi. I tested with or without DXVA on all of the codecs. No diffrence in stuttering only more or less CPU usage.

 

But I have now googled a lttle bit and found that it could be my ATI 9600 (non PRO) card that is not good enough for WMR9 in these resolutions.?

 

Or could it be that the deinterlacing is done on several places at the same time?

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What about VMR7?

 

Don't believe that the Radeon 9600 isn't strong enough. DXVA should be more demanding. Do you have some links?

Edited by CiNcH
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Probably you would like to test the following:

 

- download GraphEdit

 

- start DVBViewer

 

- start GraphEdit and go to 'File' -> 'Connect to remote graph...' (or Ctrl+G)

 

- look for the graph with audio/video processing and press Ok

 

- remove the 'DVBV OSD Source' filter by simply selecting it and pressing DEL

 

- go back to DVBViewer and check how smooth video is being rendered

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Thanks I will try this when I get home!

I also found out that WMR9 can work in both software mode and hardware mode. Do any one know how to check this and how to enable/disable?

I have used graphedit a couple of times before so I am familiar with it.

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Facts about VMR:

 

VMR: (Video Mixing Renderer) Historically VMR started with primitive de-interlacing capability but improved with each onset of new releases of Direct X. - This comes in two major "flavors" VMR7 and VMR9. VMR7 (initally simply called "VMR") was an initial trial, so to speak, of newer advanced video mixing abilities using the 3D pipeline and the DirectX Video Acceleration API, it was only available in Windows XP. VMR9 is a newer, some what different, and improved VMR that comes with DirectX 9 therefore it can work on any system that can install DirectX 9, but VMR9 has more strenuous hardware requirements than VMR7 (VMR7, as you can guess, is VMR using DirectX 7/8 level technology.) For VMR7 You need a DirectX 8.1 compliant card to utilize VMR7's deinterlacing and filtering.

 

For VMR9 you need DX9 installed and recent DX9 compliant drivers for your video card installed. A fully DirectX 9 compliant video card (GeForce FX family or Radeon 9500+) is recommended so that all VMR9 features (specifically, the newer DX9 deinterlacing and filtering) can be utilized; for basic VMR9 support DirectX 8.1 level cards will do fine and some DX7 level cards may work providing they meet some requirements.

 

Since VMR9 actually uses the 3D pipeline in a graphics processor many more filtering and advanced source/stream mixing possibilities exist. This is considered the next way to display advanced video data by Microsoft, it is intended to supersede the old "mapped memory" style "overlay".

 

VMR in general should not make image quality worse, if it it does, the first thing to do is to update your graphics card drivers, this has been known to help greatly; please note that older generation cards may not be fully compatible with VMR9.

 

Many peices of software are being updated to include support for VMR9 as it is mulitplatform and more advanced then the WinXP only VMR7.

For VMR7 display support Windows XP and a newer graphics card such as a GeForce4 MX or newer is needed. For the advanced filtering and deinterlacing of VMR7 a DirectX 8.1 compliant 3D graphics card is needed, in the ATI world this would be the Radeon 8500/9000/9100/9200 family.

 

For VMR9 display a DirectX 8 level card will work fine, but for the advanced filtering and deinterlacing a fully DirectX 9 compliant 3D graphics card (Radeon 9500+) is needed (as VMR9 uses the pixel shaders to perform all the advanced filtering in hardware).

 

I would say that a Radeon 9600 should just work fine, at least when using VMR7.

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Yes, since it seems to work in Windvd an powerdvd with VMR9 it seems like it is something in DVBViewer.

I will try the tip I got from you "- remove the 'DVBV OSD Source' filter by simply selecting it and pressing DEL

" and see if that helps first.

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Differences between a Radeon 9600 and a 9600 XT/Pro is only clock speed right?

 

I have got a Mobility Radeon 9700 which is based on exactly the 9600 core with some power management additions and downclocked it to 120 MHz which should be much below your configuration. A Pentium M is downclocked to 1000 MHz. VMR9 works without dropping a single frame.

 

Probably you should also try to disable deinterlacing (force film in nVIDIA decoders for example). Probably pixel shader units are too slow to perform pixel-adaptive deinterlacing flawlessly due to downclocked Radeon.

Somehow I messed up something inside my system so I can't switch to pixel-adaptive deinterlacing any longer (or it is due to Catalyst 6.8).

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Ok, got back pixel-adaptive deinterlacing with Catalyst 6.7.

 

Situation is as follows:

 

-> Mobility Radeon 9700 (= Radeon 9600 Core) with both GPU core and memory downclocked to 120 MHz.

-> Pentium-M downclocked to 1 GHz

-> using DXVA and VMR9 (with pixel-adaptive de-interlacing)

 

VMR does not drop a frame as the properties page indicates...

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I tried to remove the 'DVBV OSD Source' filter but it did not make a diffrence.

 

I do not get dropped frames when I look in the vmr9 renderer, but when watching the video it is not fluent and smooth. I only get that in overlay, and there is also a big diffrence in detail between Overlay and VMR9. VMR9 looks soo good in detail.

 

I also tried to use ffdshow on overlay but it is not possible, I can only have ffdshow in VMR7 or VMR9?

I wanted to try the option "High quality YV12 to RGB conversion" in ffdshow using overlay, but that was not possible. I did set the ffdshow to "Raw video = all supported" and also set the ffdshow in DVBViewer.

 

The DVD is also good and fluent in dvbviwer but I cant get it to VMR9 it will only use Overlay...

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Dont know if this helps u or not.

 

On my laptop which is equipped with a mobile ati 9700 card, if I enable powerplay in the Catalyst control center I get stuttering in VMRx mode. Overlay has no problem with powerplay.

 

On the other hand, if I disable powerplay it works without stutters.

 

/Gibman

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Powerplay is only avalible on Laptops with a ATI mobile chipset. It reduces the power to the chip, pobably some type of underclocking or similar.

I do not have this option on my desktop version of 9600.

 

I wonder if I should test to install an older type of driver?

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Using an older quartz.dll also helped a lot of people getting rid of glitches. Just startup Windows in save mode, then go to C:\WINDOWS\System32, rename existing quartz.dll to quartzbak.dll and finally replace quartz.dll with the one from the downloaded zip file. The backup just in case you run into trouble with the "new" one.

 

This is about all I have found out during my last week research about glitches. Hope it helps :bye: . At least you are better off with ATi... nVIDIA is really a pain when it comes to VMR.

 

 

I wonder if I should test to install an older type of driver?

I am now using latest Omega driver which is based on ATi's Catalyst v6.7 and it is working like a charm even with the decimated configuration I just mentioned.

 

 

Powerplay is only avalible on Laptops with a ATI mobile chipset. It reduces the power to the chip, pobably some type of underclocking or similar.

Yes, PowerPlay clocks down GPU core and memory but also lowers voltage and shuts down unused parts of the GPU.

Edited by CiNcH
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Hello,

 

Honestly, I believe the 9600 won't offer full support for VMR9.

 

Minimum requirement is graphic card with DircetX9 step "c" support.

 

I used the 9600 before my X1300 PCI_E.

 

On my projector, the picture looked terrible, whatever any sophisticated filter+post process set in use.

 

VMR7 is not so that good, neither the X1300 under VMR9.

 

Presently, all DVD softwares/ mpeg filters are designed for Overlay anyway, I guess we have to wait for Vista so that things move.

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

Cheers

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