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jaketheman

Will DVBviewer be COOL and good looking in the future ..

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jaketheman

Hi all

 

I have been using MCE, MediaPortal, DVBViewer and other software for a long time now.

 

My opinion is that DVBViewer is the best in Quality and configuration and is a GREAT piece of software for viewing DVB TV.

 

BUT ... the user interface and user handling realy needs a makeover.

 

I know that there are skins that can change the LOOK of things ,but that is nto enough to make DVBViewer COOL and easy to use.

 

It would be great to see a user inteface and configuration change to make this technically exelent software into the best Media Software around.

 

The only reason so many people use MS MCE is the easy user interface for the family and the good looking interface.

 

Also MCE can all be operated by a farely simple remote control thanks to the thinking of how users would like to use it.

 

 

Can we expect to see a DVBViewer that takes DVBViewer from technically good software to a GREAT COOL looking software that is easaly operated ?

 

 

I would like to see a mix of design from AppleTV and MCE but with the best Media handling engine underneath it "DVBViewer".

 

Is that ever going to happen ? ... is the developers on this team only "Geeks" :-) trying to handle media assets in a windoew application ?

 

 

I know that a lot of work is needed, but i think that this application would beat all the others if the developers tried to make the OSD like AppleTV and MCE and using a simple mind on the handling.

 

This is just my small thoughts how to make DVBViewer even better and more userfriendly.

 

 

Regards from one happy DVBViewer owner that uses DVBViewer to watch HD TV but using MCE for everything else ...

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sw4y

with a little bit of work on your own, it's very easy to make DVBViewer "wife-accepted" (my girlfriend is not really a computer expert and she is easily abled to handle it...).

all you got to do is to choose the skin you like most and configure a remote control the way you like it.

i think all this can be done within one hour of time, so it's not really a problem.

 

after that, you'll only need your mouse or keyboard for changes in your setup or updates, etc...

 

believe me, it's that easy...

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Kuni
with a little bit of work on your own, it's very easy to make DVBViewer "wife-accepted" (my girlfriend is not really a computer expert and she is easily abled to handle it...).

all you got to do is to choose the skin you like most and configure a remote control the way you like it.

i think all this can be done within one hour of time, so it's not really a problem.

 

after that, you'll only need your mouse or keyboard for changes in your setup or updates, etc...

 

believe me, it's that easy...

 

 

So tell me, how using the OSD I can control the slider bar rather than have to use the incremental jump forward +5,+10 second

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sw4y

I don't think you can do it. But I think I don't need it.

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jf2020

I'm not in the secret of gods but maybe V4.0 will bring some changes. Now I would like to say that I mostly agree with sw4y. Spend a bit a time tweaking you installation and you will see how easy it is to use (I'm not talking only for myself but for a family of five where everyone is very happy with the software). IMHO the Concinnity 3D has the best look and maybe you should give it a try if you've not done so yet.

 

The main question is what is you main activity and why are you using DVBViewer? If you use it to listen to your MP3 it's likely not the best choice. Now if you mainly use to watch and record TV you can't beat it. A good example is how Ok and the four arrows are handled by DVBViewer by default. Need to get the miniEPG on the current channel? push OK. Need to zap channels? Arrow Up/Down Need to change the volume? Arrow left/Right.

 

At the end of the day what really matters is reliability, reliability and reliability. When someone schedules a record he/she wants to be sure that the program will be recorded. When switching channels having the minimum lag possible is also a must.

 

Now you're also right there're certainly many things that could be improved in the more HTPC part of the application. Maybe what you can do is give very precise examples of what you would like to see and exactly how it could work. I don't think that make it like MCE is enough.

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jaketheman

Hi jf2020

 

Thanks for the respons :-)

 

I have spend many hours and mails to Christian for designing a good userinterface.

 

I have also done some Photoshop work with certain files to make it better.

 

I have also mapped my remote buttons to Input buttons.

 

And as i said, it is a great app., when working from a windows mode and great quality.

 

What i need is a simple and good looking OSD interface that makes this app. suttle on the eyes and easy to operate.

 

I dont mean it need to look like MCE, but userinterface from MCE is one of the best.

 

One thing to remember is that most people use the computer for all media: Music, TV, Movies, pictures and other.

 

EVERYTHING should be operated with remote control.

 

It is fine to map actions to buttons, but user experince would be great if ordinary actions is mapped other is in MENU when wanted from user.

 

Examples of improvement:

 

EPG screen should be more like MCE. A simple screen to give users a overlook over whats on in the near time on the channels (8-12 channels on screen) . when navigating to a show and pressing "menu" it gives some user acftions to handle.

AND series handling. It should be able to handle series. When the kids want to record all series of Simpsons and it is on different times on different days, it should be able to handle this natively.

TV: when watching TV, button UP:gives next channel info, without switching. ENTER switches to selected show. LEFT/RIGHT: gives the earlyer/future show on the selected channel.

SOUND: (is everyone using a HTCP not connected to a sound reciever or other AMP ?) i mean using to volume output from computer to computer speakers is that not something that was done several years ago?

I mean even the people with speakers on computer have remotes for the speakers today.

Drop the left/right to handle volume output and use other input keys for people that want this control.

Music: Well i have some ideas, but i think we should look to MCE again. Its nice and easy operated.

Pictures: Also some ideas but user experince is highly appreciated.

 

I have uploaded a screen shot of my DVBViewer screen.

 

Just to give an idea of what i mean with simple user control.

 

Let me know if this is waste of time or if i should go deeper in descriping ideas ...!!!!!

 

I realy want DVBViewer to be the HTPC software. It is great software and best Quality i have seen. Just need Userexperince handled better and a cool OSD engine.

 

Thanks for listening ...

 

Regards.

post-23864-1220254034_thumb.jpg

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UiP

I must say that I agree 100% with jaketheman's wishes...

 

BR

// UiP

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Bathman

I very much agree with those wises also.

 

Although I feel that the present HTPC interface is very pretty you can't get the interaction/ease of use with the remote that I need. The fact that you can't make series recordings is also a bind.

 

I wait for Version 4 with baited breath.

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squizzer22

+1 :)

 

Some time ago, if I well remember I requested some better record management (series handling).

 

Squizzer.

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jf2020
+1 :)

 

Some time ago, if I well remember I requested some better record management (series handling).

 

Squizzer.

 

as far as series are concerned you should have a look at EPGPlus plugin. You can do a lot of things with it...

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Valts

+1

 

Altho have to say that non SD skins for example don't work for me properly + there are VMR fix 0,0-1,1 driver issues... :) Have doubts that it's even program's fault.

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Benarty

It's not fair to point out the positive sections from other HTPC software to point out that DVBViewer is missing these features.

If you like the way that windows mediacenter works, great, You have the perfect HTPC software then.

DVBViewer is still under development so be a littlebit patient and see what the new features are.

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Valts
It's not fair to point out the positive sections from other HTPC software to point out that DVBViewer is missing these features.

If you like the way that windows mediacenter works, great, You have the perfect HTPC software then.

DVBViewer is still under development so be a littlebit patient and see what the new features are.

 

Well I am not really comparing to other software features. Stability wise I can say that DVBViewer pretty much blows them out of the water so to speak :) , but there is always a room for improvement, some areas more, some less... Maybe devs might consider switching licensing to maybe yearly subscriptions if that would REALLY fuel development. Because the base for it seems to be very good.

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jaketheman
It's not fair to point out the positive sections from other HTPC software to point out that DVBViewer is missing these features.

If you like the way that windows mediacenter works, great, You have the perfect HTPC software then.

DVBViewer is still under development so be a littlebit patient and see what the new features are.

 

As said in first post, i like DVBViewer and use it for HD tv. MCE for the rest.

 

This is the "Suggestions & Ideas" section of the forum so i gues it is the right place to suggest things that will make DVBViewer even better.

 

If other people and software have done things in a better way, why should we not look at how these things a done - and take those ideas and put them into DVBViewer ?

 

Looking forward to see the new version of this great App.

 

Regards

Edited by jaketheman

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jaketheman

Any news on a V.4 ?

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Bathman

I also have to agree.

 

DVBViewer is by far the best app for realabilty, speed of channel change. But its remote interface and its lacking ability to record series with remote from the epg a weakness (EPGPlus plugin although poerfull is a bind). If these could be addressed in V4 then I would be over the moon and I am sure the number of subscribers would increase significantly.

 

I actually think the default skin looks really good I just wish it good be driven easier.

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J.B.
Any news on a V.4 ?

 

I think the current beta is a release candidate for V4 so have a look at that to see what has changed.

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avoidz

I say keep the Media Player 6.4 look of the standard interface. It's one of the reasons this program is so easy to use and quick to respond to inputs. Don't change it, please.

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McenterFreak2

And now 4 is out, and i am sorry to see that all the news are burried deep under the user interface. None of the wishes here have been taken into consideration.

So yes, we still have a very technical solution, with a lot of new technical stuff, burried into the configuration menus.

What could have been nice would be:

The WAF installation feature:

After technical installation, should come the question: Do you want me to activate the WAF mode, and if yes, which remote do you want to use?

Thereafter no keyboard is required, no mouse is required. Volume up, volume down, channel shift etc. works rigth after installation with the selected remote (MCE2005 or others). I know that i can use/teach my MCE remote, but i often need to go to the "hardcore" mode to get things working (not very good "WAF")

Another thing we miss:

Recording Service and EPGPlus (at least the features) should be 100% integrated, and should not interfere with daily use. As it is now, it is so filled with problems. I love the idea of plugins, but thes two critical components should be integrated into the main SW

 

So please, DVBViewer developers, use resources to make this the world no. 1 in user friendlyness (i believe its already no. 1, technically)

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Kuni
And now 4 is out, and i am sorry to see that all the news are burried deep under the user interface. None of the wishes here have been taken into consideration.

So yes, we still have a very technical solution, with a lot of new technical stuff, burried into the configuration menus.

What could have been nice would be:

The WAF installation feature:

After technical installation, should come the question: Do you want me to activate the WAF mode, and if yes, which remote do you want to use?

Thereafter no keyboard is required, no mouse is required. Volume up, volume down, channel shift etc. works rigth after installation with the selected remote (MCE2005 or others). I know that i can use/teach my MCE remote, but i often need to go to the "hardcore" mode to get things working (not very good "WAF")

Another thing we miss:

Recording Service and EPGPlus (at least the features) should be 100% integrated, and should not interfere with daily use. As it is now, it is so filled with problems. I love the idea of plugins, but thes two critical components should be integrated into the main SW

 

So please, DVBViewer developers, use resources to make this the world no. 1 in user friendlyness (i believe its already no. 1, technically)

 

Yes developers, please indulge every idiot's demands. And make it quick, we have users who have forked over BIG $$$ and who need these changes NOW, or they'll be forced to write another nonsensical rant.

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jaketheman

So i still think this is the suggestions and Ideas section, or am i wrong.

 

I started this thread because i like DVBViewer and think it is great software.

 

But it would be even greater for me if the OSD section could be enhanced. I use my computer as media server and controls it by remote.

 

If users like the mediaplayer 6.4 look, please just use it in windows mode. I dont care.

 

I just came up with some suggestions and Ideas to make the software even better, when using the system on a computer hidden away and controlled from remote.

 

Im sorry to see that it still has the same OSD userinterface as before ... nothing new ... nothing better ...

 

 

All the things done in the engine is great and it proves to me how great this software is.

 

Just to bad nothing is done to wrap it up into something that would blow all other mediasoftware away.

 

Why do you think MS media center is so great ? because of the many features of mounting iso's and wheather views - or because it is good looking and easy to use ?

 

 

My bet is that DVBViewer could tripple sales - if wrapped in nice and "living" userinterface.

 

 

merry christmas everyone.

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Lars_MQ
because it is good looking and easy to use ?

My bet is that DVBViewer could tripple sales - if wrapped in nice and "living" userinterface.

Yes and all we have to do is kill 7/10 of the features and possibilities to make it easy to use, it would be nothing more than another MCE clone...

 

Why do you think MS media center is so great ?

Because it is preinstalled on every new Vista PC and people don't know what real software can do? :D

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jaketheman

OK, so when administrator makes this statement in forum i assume that DVBViewer will not get new userinterface.

 

Developers like to develope and not spend time on GUI.

 

Classic example of good software engines not making full potential because of poor userinterface.

 

 

Nice work on engine btw...

 

 

Are there any other companys that use DVBViewer as engine with better GUI ?

 

Other than Digital-everywhere that has made nice GUI on TV part, with success.

 

Could be great if same GUI was used on rest of DVBViewer.

 

Regards

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Lars_MQ

You could use another OSD skin.

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robani

I think that if a remote control mode was added (without the need of Learning the button setup) would make a lot of people happy. Or that one could map a remote control button the several functions (in different screens of course).

 

For example I want to press the OK button and get the channel list, then select the channel I want and then press the OK button again to virew this channel.

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Lars_MQ
(without the need of Learning the button setup)

Well you could start by setting a good example and publish your remote configuration file, stating which remote etc. so other people can import it (you have seen the import/export buttons for these cases, haven't you?) and don't have to setup the keys themselves.

Oh and be prepared that they will complain, because they think, you did set it up completely wrong and it should be done this and that way... You see a pattern here? :)

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mr_chaela
For example I want to press the OK button and get the channel list, then select the channel I want and then press the OK button again to virew this channel.

 

That's exactly what I want to do and why I asked for a new command to view the current folder in the favorites list. The original (favorites) channellist command would be used to select a satellite and channel, then the new command to further select a channel on that sat - just like an STB works.

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hollymolly
For example I want to press the OK button and get the channel list, then select the channel I want and then press the OK button again to virew this channel.

 

That's exactly what I want to do and why I asked for a new command to view the current folder in the favorites list. The original (favorites) channellist command would be used to select a satellite and channel, then the new command to further select a channel on that sat - just like an STB works.

 

 

exactly just like a stb. why not?

 

but don't mind people here don't like criticism or if asking for features. i also got pi**e* by those gods so i stopped asking and check every day for another software is more "living-room" like. unfortunately there is none than DVBViewer because stability is unbeatable with it and that is still key, right? don't want to reboot, restart every 10 minutes - my wife calling me in office - honey tv is not working anymore...

 

but there are some valid improvements that would make DVBViewer even better. or tell me how i can do that.

 

wanted to show a couple of mt2s vids (vmc cannot play:( done on my hd cam. i had to single click each file and after the end to navigate to the next movie and play it. family was looking kind of weird...

 

a simple play button click on folder could play all of them, right?

 

this is something that cant be hard to programm but you need to understand your users and what they do with the software. programmers tend to code and test when one file plays okay, job done...

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jaketheman

Just my point.

 

DVBViewer is great software, but could be used better and more easy from a users point of view.

 

I would gladly help to make this better, but every time i try to reach out to makers of DVBViewer - they stop me with saying "use other skin".

 

Im not asking for more features - or less.

 

The software is great but please try rethink how users would like to use it.

 

I would help if they let me.

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Moses
exactly just like a stb. why not?

 

STB = works with just one remote, with just one reception method (dvb-t/s/c, ATSC, IPTV...), no configurable OSD, Filters, etc... of course, if there are no options, there is nothing to worry about... but if you like to cut down DVBViewer to that status, then it's not the correct software for you (and I doubt that a HTPC is the correct thing for you).

 

You'll have to pick what you want from the "sea of possibilities" DVBViewer offers and configure that like you want it. You'll have to do that once, and then you'll have exactly what you want... you can do it yourself and don't give that task to your wife, so the WAF is not affected by that.

 

You are correct, if you say that configuring DVBViewer as HTPC is a hard thing to do and some things could be easier... but some of the work will always be necessary without cutting down options drasticaly. For example, learning your remote will always be necessary, if there is no config for your particular remote that suits you. Alternatively you could donor every possible remote to the DVBViewer team... maybe then they'll include configs for those. :)

 

There are two critical things to a good HTPC with DVBViewer: learning your remote and choosing the right osd skin. Both can't be done by DVBViewer or the dev's for you... be sure to try some of the skins and experiment with the remote and all the possible actions (be sure to look at the actions in options->input, that you can add).

Edited by Moses

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mr_chaela

@Moses

I do agree with you to a large extent BUT... it that 'sea of possibilities' does not include what, to some people, is the blindingly obvious, then the program can easily become a pain to use.

 

In my case, using a motorized system, I have about a dozen different sats to list in the favourites (all neatly segregated in their own folders.

To change to a different sat I call the (favourites) channellist, scroll to the required sat and choose a channel - excellent.

However, every time I want to change channel on that sat (you've guessed it) I call the channellist, scroll down to the sat that I'm already on, press OK , scroll down to the channel I want, press OK - not excellent, a pain in fact, and I see no way of getting round this with the current 'sea of possibilities'.

 

To me the obvious solution is to be able to view the current folder in the (favorites) channellist.

 

I'm you just turned 60 and have dealt with many programmers writing specialist software, and have to say that the problem with many of them is that they get totally embroiled in how they see a programme should work and lose sight of what the end user really wants.

 

Having said that and hopefully not upsetting the developers too much I think that in general DVBViewer if by far the best software available and after paying a mere 15€ that I have little or no say in it's development but. I just wish...

Edited by mr_chaela

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Benarty

WAF (in most cases) is simply zapping channels up/down and via menu, record at once and start recorded video.

They don't use the configurable section but things have to work if they insert a DVD or Blueray disc.

 

Jump xx seconds, cut out the commercials and they will not jump but even if they do, a slider says nothing

if the screen shows no video.

 

So instead of jump, fast forward is more logical but might be not so easy with digital data.

 

If you would use a slider on the default thebn the slider will still 'jump' to 5,10 and so on seconds.

What DVBViewer shows on the OSD is sort of Webpage.

The best approach to improve the OSD is look at a DVBViewer API.

This API describes what is possible and how to handle the call.

 

DVBViewer will come to a point where the end is reached towards the core of the DVBViewer application.

Well, if no new hardware becomes available (dvb-s3/4/5/6/7...)

Then it's time to spend more time towards GUI HTPC based. So computer as mediacenter connected to TV.

 

I rather have that all tings work before the GUI is changed tho.

And it's not easy with all those different hardware/drivers, problems generated by users, by buggy drivers, by faulty hardware....

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Moses
In my case, using a motorized system, I have about a dozen different sats to list in the favourites (all neatly segregated in their own folders.

To change to a different sat I call the (favourites) channellist, scroll to the required sat and choose a channel - excellent.

However, every time I want to change channel on that sat (you've guessed it) I call the channellist, scroll down to the sat that I'm already on, press OK , scroll down to the channel I want, press OK - not excellent, a pain in fact, and I see no way of getting round this with the current 'sea of possibilities'.

 

Just forget the favorites... edit the channellist to your needs (you can define different roots as your "folders"). The (OSD) channellist remembers the channel your are on and selects it. The OSD favorite list should do so, too (it does over here), but if you mix both, that's often problematic.

 

WAF (in most cases) is simply zapping channels up/down and via menu, record at once and start recorded video.

They don't use the configurable section but things have to work if they insert a DVD or Blueray disc.

 

Work's perfectly, just the way you describe it, with DVBViewer, over here.

 

Jump xx seconds, cut out the commercials and they will not jump but even if they do, a slider says nothing

if the screen shows no video.

 

Why is there no video on your screen? You must have missconfigured something.

 

So instead of jump, fast forward is more logical but might be not so easy with digital data.

 

There is nothing logical in fast forward.. it's just something you are more used to. My girl friend is perfectly happy with jumps and now complains about those "stupid VRCs that can't even jump, you always have to sit and wait".

 

 

Of course there are many things, that still need to be improved, and in time, they will be, but it's not true that a nice looking HTPC with a high WAF is impossible with DVBViewer.

Edited by Moses

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Lars_MQ
My girl friend is perfectly happy with jumps and now complains about those

The perfect example of how to do it. Cut the ties to the technique from the last century (VCR) and do some proper explaining.

Complaining about the WAF does only mean one thing: the guy is too stupid to limit his explanations to only the actually needed parts or he didn't understand the system at all. In that case ask your 10 year old son to explain it to you. :(

 

Remember? you never got the the blinking 12:00 on the VCR away. Ask the kids and they'll fix it for you ;):biggrin:

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Griga
DVBViewer will come to a point where the end is reached towards the core of the DVBViewer application. Then it's time to spend more time towards GUI HTPC based.

Not in the economic system we are living in. Product cycles become shorter and shorter, a self-accelerating process... the companies have to make money, which requires new products, things people don't have already. New standards, OS versions, graphic cards with half-baked drivers, DVB cards with poorly documented APIs (if at all), among other PC add-ons that people want to be supported, video & audio formats, decoders etc... hopeless to catch up with it, no time to let things settle down and make it really nice and stable.

 

Where would we be if we had decided to ignore DVB-S2, H.264, HDTV, BluRay, Windows Vista, the EVR etc. altogether, in order to focus on the DVBViewer UI? And Windows 7 is already on the horizon...

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Kuni
Just forget the favorites... edit the channellist to your needs (you can define different roots as your "folders"). The (OSD) channellist remembers the channel your are on and selects it. The OSD favorite list should do so, too (it does over here), but if you mix both, that's often problematic.

Work's perfectly, just the way you describe it, with DVBViewer, over here.

Why is there no video on your screen? You must have missconfigured something.

There is nothing logical in fast forward.. it's just something you are more used to. My girl friend is perfectly happy with jumps and now complains about those "stupid VRCs that can't even jump, you always have to sit and wait".

Of course there are many things, that still need to be improved, and in time, they will be, but it's not true that a nice looking HTPC with a high WAF is impossible with DVBViewer.

 

It is impossible, unless your WAF blindly accepts there's not a better or at least alternative way of skipping ads.

 

I get that you won't change it, I don't get hyour attitude that it's the best way.

 

How is jumping either 5 seconds too far into an ad break then having to jump back or not jumping far enough and having to jump forward again, only to miss the start of the show and on and on practical?

 

Why not simply have the ^&$#*ing OPTION of either FFW X5 or X10 and YOU get to control when it stops OR have a slide bar with a preview so you can, again, CONTROL where you are.

 

I'm sure these concepts are totally and utterly stupid, and that everyone who has implemented them or requested them is also stupid, but hey, you didn't write the software for youselves so how about indulging us that ONE simple feature, however you want to incorporate it?

Edited by Kuni

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raty

Slightly off topic, but could it be possible (via config xml) to allow rather than timed jumps but blank video jumps? Ads tend to have a blank video frame inserted between the prog and the advert itself. This feature might help???

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ElecardFAN

My girlfriend likes the Pimped Old Default skin - since there are not that much buttons and additional functions listed. Anyway porting one of those popular XBMC skins would be nice. A official okay from the original author assumed :biggrin: I started playing with the idea to port PM3 HD and Mediastream, but this is hell of a job. Maybe some others would like to help, and maybe one of the developers could create a simple import function for the osd skinner. I know that this would not port the skin for 100%, but would help at least adding the images, listboxes etc.

 

Happy new year

Peter

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Moses
Why not simply have the ^&$#*ing OPTION of either FFW X5 or X10 and YOU get to control when it stops OR have a slide bar with a preview so you can, again, CONTROL where you are.

 

Maybe it's just not as simple to implement as you might think... especialy if you don't have your "own" decoders that you can fit this function to, but have to make sure that most decoders work with it, because if there is one popular decoder that will crash while forwarding a big number of people will start complaining why you don't simply fix that damn feature... :biggrin:

You get the point? :(

 

I don't know, where the problem is, but be sure that the feature is not so simple to add, because otherways it would already be there.

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Bathman

"but it's not true that a nice looking HTPC with a high WAF is impossible with DVBViewer"

 

But it should not be difficult to do it should be obvious. And also when you have it set up too look nice some simple HTPC features such as series record and not possible with the remote.

 

I do find it strange that ease of use isn't made more of a priority.

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