Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Lurkah

New features!

Recommended Posts

Lurkah

Here's a list of requested features;

 

1. Bitrate display in status bar as mentioned elsewhere.

2. Pause button on the toolbar.

3. Improved recording scheduler, selecting days of the week etc - like dabbar.

4. Dynamic favorites menu so number of favorites can be increased. Possibly folders, ideally like IE's links toolbar.

5. Changing channels by EPG channel number? Digiboxes for Sky do it, so clearly it's possible.

6. Some sort of error or status message when channel selected is encrypted.

7. Http streaming like DAB applications.

8. Low profile mode for radio, no need for the screen box.

9. Option for current program EPG information scrolling in status bar.

10. Bugs fixed :)

Share this post


Link to post
Guest Michael

Here's a list of requested features;

 

1. Bitrate display in status bar as mentioned elsewhere.

2. Pause button on the toolbar.

3. Improved recording scheduler, selecting days of the week etc - like dabbar.

4. Dynamic favorites menu so number of favorites can be increased. Possibly folders, ideally like IE's links toolbar.

5. Changing channels by EPG channel number? Digiboxes for Sky do it, so clearly it's possible.

6. Some sort of error or status message when channel selected is encrypted.

7. Http streaming like DAB applications.

8. Low profile mode for radio, no need for the screen box.

9. Option for current program EPG information scrolling in status bar.

10. Bugs fixed ;)

1. hmmm you have resolution, fps, audiobitrate.... why do you need videobitrate???

2. i like the pause button in status bar.....

3. not bad idea... for all others... a screen -> http://www.dabbar.co.uk/manual/schedule.gif

4. somebody requested it elsewhere.... should be included ....

5. don't understand your idea....

6. good idea...

7. why do you want internet streaming in a dvb program.... ???

8. i have already mentioned this some time ago..... want it too :)

9. don't like the idea.... push "^" for displaying epg.....

10. hehe ... bugfixing is always a good thing...

Share this post


Link to post
Klausing

7. why do you want internet streaming in a dvb program.... ???

Hi Michael,

i think he want put the mpg-stream from the DVBViewer in a private network. :) So the other people could also look TV (without a SS2)

 

Cheers Steffen

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

i think he want put the mpg-stream from the DVBViewer in a private network. ;) So the other people could also look TV (without a SS2)

 

Cheers Steffen

Yeah, so you can stream a radio station to a notebook computer over WiFi for instance :)

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

This will be implemented in RadLight 4 Pro and thus in DVBViewer as well but I hope you are aware of the fact that there is only one tuner = only one station tuned at the time :)

Share this post


Link to post
Klausing

@Davanger

do you know a project like http://www.videolan.org/ but for windows?

I think that could be the answer of this problem. (or we get a SS2 viewer for linux :) )

 

Cheers Steffen

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

Yes, it's called RadLight 4 ;)

 

We are working on this for one European telco ... they want to run something like DivX TV and Radio via satellite so why not to use it for DVBViewer :)

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

Right to clear stuff up.

 

I'm talking about radio stuff mostly, I've almost no interest in video because there's virtually nothing available on Astra 28.2E FTA. I'm using the SS2 and DVBViewer as a higher quality replacement for Digital Audio Radio, IE a Psion Wavefinder and Dabbar.

 

There is no bitrate display for radio stations, only video. I want a bitrate display for radio stations :)

 

With regards to point 5, there is some mechanism for discovering channel frequencies and so on by EPG channel number. Sky digiboxes in the UK have simple channel numbers for most (but not quite all) the channels available on Astra 28.2E. I have absolutely no idea how this works but what I was proposing was changing or at least adding stations by being able to specify these channels, this would involve reading whatever Sky is making available to provide the EPG service for the digiboxes. I don't know if this is possible, it's just a request that would be highly useful. This is related to the very broken channel scanning and channel importing. I know the channel number of a radio station I want but I don't know the frequency details so I can't add it manually and the import stuff is broken. Shrug.

 

With regards to point 7, the internet streaming is indeed purely for a LAN. I saw this primarily only useful for radio... This is a standard mechanism for DAB software for example. My Psion Wavefinder is plugged into a server in the attic so it's aerial can pick up DAB well (Digital Audio Broadcasting, I'm not sure if you have this in continental Europe?). However all 3 flats in my house are networked. Any machine can stream a radio station onto the PC (or even my Slimp3!) on the same multiplex. It's fantastic, if only DAB bitrates were as high as satellite!

 

I do understand that DVBViewer may be more limited and only be able to serve one channel at one time. So what I propose is something very basic. I propose just having a single streaming port which outputs the audio from the current channel as a stream. At the least it means you can run winamp locally (which I *really* want to be able to do) and connect to the stream but also it means you can play the radio from any other computer on the LAN (or in my house in my case).

 

It could even be an 'ICY' shoutcast stream which would allow transmission of the EPG data for that channel as well, this would scroll those details across Winamp etc. But one thing at a time eh? ;)

 

I have no idea what you're talking about with regards to 'radlight'.

 

9, I'm willing to accept having the EPG information scrolling in status bar may not be desirable. However I think I would like a low-profile way of displaying the current EPG information for a radio station without bringing up the huge EPG gui.

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

I'm talking about radio stuff mostly, I've almost no interest in video because there's virtually nothing available on Astra 28.2E FTA. I'm using  the SS2 and DVBViewer as a higher quality replacement for Digital Audio Radio, IE a Psion Wavefinder and Dabbar.

There's always news and TCM :) Just to clarify for other members of the board, the broadcasters in the UK (including the eminent BBC) have little regard for technical quality, the quality of DAB broadcasts are depreciating at a rate of 33% per annum, BBC Radio 4 for instance used to be 192k stereo the same as Astra but it's now 80k mono more often than not. Anyway, you get the idea, so we've defected to Astra, unfortunately we've been spoilt with simultaneous recordings/playing and ICY streaming so some people tend to be a little demanding ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

I do understand that DVBViewer may be more limited and only be able to serve one channel at one time. So what I propose is something very basic. I propose just having a single streaming port which outputs the audio from the current channel as a stream. At the least it means you can run winamp locally (which I *really* want to be able to do) and connect to the stream but also it means you can play the radio from any other computer on the LAN (or in my house in my case).

 

It could even be an 'ICY' shoutcast stream which would allow transmission of the EPG data for that channel as well, this would scroll those details across Winamp etc. But one thing at a time eh? :)

 

I have no idea what you're talking about with regards to 'radlight'.

Audio and Video multicast streaming over LAN will be supported. This basically means every computer on the network will be able to connect to the broadcast. Some sort of EPG should be suppoted as well. The technology used will be RLSF (RadLight streaming format) and player supporting this advanced features will be RadLight 4 Pro. So, no Shoutcast, Icecast, Winamp, Whatever ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

Ahh a lock in scheme to make me use a program I don't want. Wasn't quite what I was after :)

 

Still, this is moot. There's a lot of work that needs to be done just to make DVBViewer work properly let alone adding features like this.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

Ahh a lock in scheme to make me use a program I don't want.

Everybody will want to use RadLight 4 :)

 

There's a lot of work that needs to be done just to make DVBViewer work properly let alone adding features like this.

I guess that a major rewritten version of DVBViewer is ahead of us ... of course after the current bugs are fixed and to-do list features added. So don't worry about that right now ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

Everybody will want to use RadLight 4

If you're so confident of that then you don't need to force people to use it by inventing proprietary protocols for no reason. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

Everybody will want to use RadLight 4

If you're so confident of that then you don't need to force people to use it by inventing proprietary protocols for no reason. :)

Nobody is forcing you to buy DVBViewer or Radlight Mr Lurkah, if don't want the additional features then nobody is making you pay <_<

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

1. I seriously doubt that Shoutcast, Icecast, Whatever is suited for multicast.

2. If you want to have EPG and other features then forget about Winamp.

3. There is a reason for "inventing" RLSF. Actually, we are doing this not for you nor for Christian. The fact that it could be used for DVB purposes is just a (lucky) coincidence.

4. DVBViewer = 60% based on RadLight so you are actually using RadLight right now :)

Share this post


Link to post
Klausing

The technology used will be RLSF (RadLight streaming format) and player supporting this advanced features will be RadLight 4 Pro. So, no Shoutcast, Icecast, Winamp, Whatever  :)

@ Davanger

only RLSF supports this stream? :(

The problem is, i have 2 laptops from my employer. But its forbidden to install any software on this. :) But its no problem to bring both in my network.

At this time i cant use Radlight om my pc. But if i can get Radlight as an standalone player or as a plugin for mediaplayer i would pay for this and i can use this.

Is there any chance to get this? ;)

Or have you an other solution for my problem?

 

cheers

Steffen

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

1. I seriously doubt that Shoutcast, Icecast, Whatever is suited for multicast.

And why on earth would anyone care about multicast on a LAN?

 

2. If you want to have EPG and other features then forget about Winamp.

It will display the current EPG line in the titlebar if you use the ICY streaming mechanism, DAB software does this with dynamic stuff which is updated every song and not just every episode.

 

4. DVBViewer = 60% based on RadLight so you are actually using RadLight right now

So are the bugs yours as well? :)

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

Klausing : You will have to install it. There is no other player than RadLight which supports RLSF streams.

 

Lurkah :

 

1. Multicast is the only thing that makes streaming interesting.

2. My stream, my player, your satisfaction :)

4. Sure

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

1. Multicast is the only thing that makes streaming interesting.

Err why? You seem to think there is a point to stream video over the internet from a DVB card. This is not only pretty pointless (how many people have that bandwidth) it's also most probably illegal too.

 

On a LAN, you absolutely do not require multicast. There's loads of bandwidth and you are quite unlikely to have many people watching the same stream anyway.

 

And after all that, I don't particularly care about video anyway. I can't quite think of why I would need to multicast 20 FTA shopping channels in my house. My feature requests are those which would turn DVBViewer into a peice of software which makes satellite radio work as well as DAB does.

 

You really seem to have a difficult time comprehending that the difference between features that people are requesting (this thread was my feature list request) and what you happen to want to implement for some reason.

 

Please understand, I don't want another video player. I bought DVBViewer and I'm talking about that. I hope this does not cause offense but I'm starting to get a little annoyed now with the hijacking of my feature list :)

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

:) Multicast does not work over internet.

 

On a LAN, there is absolutely no difference between multicast or unicast bandwidht requirements. And yes, there are MANY people watching the same stream, listening to the same radio stream. LAN does not necessarily mean two computers ....

 

To broadcast 20 stations you would need to have 20 DVB cards ...

 

Again, no difference between unicast and multicast in this case.

 

DVBViewer will be able to act as a server, but making a audio/video player out of TV viewer would not be the best idea.

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

Multicast does not work over internet.

Err, it does. It's very frequently used at the big stream hosting ISPs to reduce bandwidth on the major backbones substantially. Obviously all the hardware on the routes need to support it.

 

On a LAN, there is absolutely no difference between multicast or unicast bandwidht requirements.

That depends on the topography of the LAN. What possible advantage is there to multicasting anyway?

 

To broadcast 20 stations you would need to have 20 DVB cards ...

I realise that, sound it sounded pointless anyway. Most likely just be used on a local machine or one other machine on a LAN.

 

DVBViewer will be able to act as a server, but making a audio/video player out of TV viewer would not be the best idea.

I don't really know what you mean. Anyhow, if there is a mechanism to listen to radio on another machine on my LAN from the one with the DVB card, then I am happy. I would vastly prefer to use my own player. Not only because I happen to like my choice of software but via HTTP streaming, my Slimp3 hardware player can also play the radio.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

1. Sure, ISPs may use this but generally, the internet does not allow multicast.

 

2. If there is only PC-PC connection, the bandwidth requirements of multicast are the same as of unicast. If it is PC-PC-PC multicast clearly wins.

 

3. We will try to do it in such way that you (as a root user) will be able to remotely control the broadcast server.

 

4. Simply, you will click on a "act as server" button in DVBViewer and you can tune to the multicast stream from as many computers as you want. Of course, I do not see us making this in some standard way. Firstly, this project is intended to be used for secured multicast streaming so we do not want anyone to tamper with the stream and stream specs. And the second reason is, we do not believe in Winamp and do not want to support it in any way.

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

And the second reason is, we do not believe in Winamp and do not want to support it in any way.

ICY streaming isn't just Winamp though, IceCast for instance is maintained by the Ogg Vorbis guys, it's an open standard supported by a great many players and even hardware devices.

 

Trying to impose an overly complex and proprietary standard just to stream audio about is dogmatic, if you're not providing useful features inline with the majority of media players then customers won't believe in or support you.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

Receiving of Icecast and Shoutcast streams will be supported by RadLight but these do not fit our needs for the actual broadcast. That's why we decided to go for our own format.

 

I think nobody will say a word if he/she will see it working ....

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

Receiving of Icecast and Shoutcast streams will be supported by RadLight but these do not fit our needs for the actual broadcast. That's why we decided to go for our own format.

 

I think nobody will say a word if he/she will see it working ....

I think Christian should be very cautious with breaking with open standards and agreeing to a tie in to get everyone to buy Radlight, especially when DVBViewer is unique enough to carry itself. Next you'll be disabling MPEG2 recording and replacing it with transcoding to RLDF (RadLight Dogmatic Format).

 

Streaming audio without ICY is pointless, going from one Windows to PC to another is limited, it immediately excludes Linux clients, Slimp3, 3Com Audrey and various other media players you object to. Radlight looks interesting however for the majority of us here it 'does not fit our needs'.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

Noone forces you to use RadLight. You have to decide whether you want to have DVB streamed or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Klausing

it immediately excludes Linux clients,

I think Linux and MAC are big points for you Aztech !

I respect the work of RADlight people! But i think the opinion of Aztech is not wrong.

In the past we need for instance a realplayer. Today this format can play also other player. (For instance Radlight) And why is this ? ......

 

cheers

Steffen

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

Noone forces you to use RadLight. You have to decide whether you want to have DVB streamed or not.

I can quite understand why you'd use a specialist protocol for streaming video and control info, however if it lacks ICY support for simple audio streaming then it isn't much use to me, I'm probably not the only one. There's no technical reason why it requires something more complex, ICY is open, simple and it works, not to mention it works with hard devices that can't support a propriety Radlight protocol even we wanted.

 

You're right nobody forces us to use RadLight, that's fine, however you're forcing Christan's program down an illogical path to your own ends. If audio streaming abided by open standards then it would be useful to me and I'd be quite happy to purchase it, so you're only hurting yourself in that respect, however if you're going down the path of an extreme tie in then it makes me wonder why Radlight can't carry itself.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

I said this many times ... this project was not intended to be used in DVBViewer by default. You simply can't stream DivX TV via satellite using an open source format which anyone can hack very easily.

 

We will have a thing working and I do not see any reason why to change the whole system it is based on.

 

Christian will get this for free (as all the code from us), he will not have to waste his time with this feature and thus will have more time to fix those bugs you are complaining about.

 

and btw ... noone ever said there won't be a version of RadLight for Linux and Mac :)

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

You're right nobody forces us to use RadLight, that's fine, however you're forcing Christan's program down an illogical path to your own ends. If audio streaming abided by open standards then it would be useful to me and I'd be quite happy to purchase it, so you're only hurting yourself in that respect, however if you're going down the path of an extreme tie in then it makes me wonder why Radlight can't carry itself.

I guess that over time you will realize that having this "tie" is a very good thing.

 

No comments to that "you're forcing Christan's program down an illogical path to your own ends" ... you really have no idea how are these two programs connected :)

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

I said this many times ... this project was not intended to be used in DVBViewer by default. You simply can't stream DivX TV via satellite using an open source format which anyone can hack very easily.

That doesn't explain why ICY isn't going to be supported so we can simply shuttle a Layer II stream about. Your points about hacking are pretty arbitrary when it comes to DVBViewer, if the full MPEG2 stream is totally open to me on the receiver PC then why do I need a secure transport on my LAN? I'm sure security is relevant to your telco project, however it's totally over engineered for DVBViewer.

 

You seem like good guys, however you're not going to be bothering with something as simple and effective as ICY audio streaming but forcing a proprietary protocol on us instead then I won't purchase on principle, I'm sorry if that seems unreasonable.

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

I guess that over time you will realize that having this "tie" is a very good thing.

For whom exactly? Seems quite Machiavellian from where we're standing.

 

No comments to that "you're forcing Christan's program down an illogical path to your own ends" ... you really have no idea how are these two programs connected  :)

So you've given just a crash prone renderer, thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

So you've given just a crash prone renderer, thanks.

I do not like people who do not respect others people work ;)

 

We will see what can be done about Icecast. However, God forbid that you would use something else than RadLight :)

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

We will see what can be done about Icecast. However, God forbid that you would use something else than RadLight  :)

Well make it part of your premium package, if you're still paid then does it matter if it has to absolutely be used with Radlight 100% of the time. It's like buying a BMW then being forced not to drive anything else, it's not paying for the BMW that people object to, it's the needless strings attached.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

It has nothing to do with the fact that we are or are not paid. DVBViewer and RadLight are so close as Windows and Office and it is obvious that these two come together more than Windows and Joe :)

 

I understand that you would not like to use the current version for these purposes. It was never intended to be used for audio playback and has less audio related features than e.g Winamp. But I think you will change your mind when RL v4 is released, with Icecast or without it ....

 

The "tie" will allow Christian to focus on the most important tasks (mostly related to DVB itself), "everything" else will be our job, whether you like it or not (I guess, you will like that "crash prone renderer" with alphablended EPG - sure, you could live without it .... but only till the moment you saw it for the first time ;) )

Share this post


Link to post
Aztech

I understand that you would not like to use the current version for these purposes. It was never intended to be used for audio playback and has less audio related features than e.g Winamp. But I think you will change your mind when RL v4 is released, with Icecast or without it ....

Yes, but remember our broadcasters are arseholes so it would be nice to have a kind of drop in replacement for DAB which mainly means a recorder.exe that works and ICY. What do you mean "Icecast or not", how are we meant to run Radlight on this thing even if we wanted? :)

Share this post


Link to post
Guest DAvenger

Why "recorder.exe" ? You will only have to push one button to start the streaming and you would be able to continue to watch the channel locally.

 

Maybe there will be some other "this thing" :)

 

 

Yes, that means a Sewing machine with support for RLSF :);)

Edited by DAvenger

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

I can quite understand why you'd use a specialist protocol for streaming video and control info, however if it lacks ICY support for simple audio streaming then it isn't much use to me

Absolutely! It's no use to my Slimp3 for a start!

Share this post


Link to post
Lurkah

It has nothing to do with the fact that we are or are not paid. DVBViewer and RadLight are so close as Windows and Office and it is obvious that these two come together more than Windows and Joe

You keep saying this. A lot. Do you appreciate that this web site is called DVBViewer and that we are here for DVB Viewing software and not another video/audio player? As I've said before, I have my choice of players and not all of them are windows players.

 

I really don't give a damn if you don't like Winamp. Winamp isn't the only software which uses open standards.

 

We (and I mean Aztech, myself and other DAB refugees) need audio streaming via existing mechanisms. Either simple http or ICY and it's as simple as that, nothing else is suitable. Now if you want the business of these DAB refugees then it might pay to listen to what we want?

Share this post


Link to post
This thread is quite old. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...