Remote control

[neophyte]

Hello all!

 

(This is my first post - deep breath)

 

I've ordered an Airstar2 DVB-T, replacing my existing AVerMedia. To replace the AVer's appalling software I plan to buy DVBViewer (full version; btw what happened to the 'Pro' suffix? just wondering...).

 

I have a Philips Pronto universal remote and with this I have up to now controlled my various HT components - but not the HTPC itself because I don't have an IR interface with it yet. So the next logical step is to acquire an IR receiver, plus Girder. The goal of course is to be able to control everything *including* the HTPC with the Pronto - no keyboard or mouse. I've searched widely in this forum but have been unable to find any posts dealing with this subject. (I suspect there may be stuff but in German, which I don't speak, alas). Surely lots of you must by now have moved into what remotecentral.com calls "the remote community"....?

 

What I as a newbie would love to have is advice from among the very knowledeable people in this forum on whether there are known incompatibilities between DVBViewer and any of the IR receivers currently being marketed (when used in conjunction with Girder). Are any special plug-ins needed? Are there any clear favourites among available IR receivers? Both IRMAN and IR2PC look good and are cheap, but support in both cases seems an unknown quantity - specially for IRMAN. At the moment I'm favouring the Ira-3 (but I've seen one or two critical comments about its support). Are there traps to beware of with these, or any of the others?

 

One detail: I don't anticipate any need to transmit as well as receive IR, so this is an unnecessary feature for me (if it affects the price anyway). Also, I tend to prefer USB over serial port connection but I don't really know why - again, price would be the clincher all other things being equal.

 

Any help would be warmly welcomed. I'm the opposite of a geek (untergeek perhaps?...).

[Guest Lars_MQ]

As long as your receiver works with girder, there should be no problem. And for the works between girder and DVBViewer, you could do it the hard way (sendmessage) or you could simply the DVBViewer plugin for girder, which cover every command and more the DVBViewer is able to understand

[neophyte]

As long as your receiver works with girder, there should be no problem. And for the works between girder and DVBViewer, you could do it the hard way (sendmessage) or you could simply the DVBViewer plugin for girder, which cover every command and more the DVBViewer is able to understand

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

@Lars

 

Thanks for your response.

 

Tho' Girder is everywhere still being referred to as 'Freeware', I find that it's now nothing of the kind (the v. 4 Pro beta is $74.99 and the Standard beta is $37.49 - both after 20% discounts).

 

I can't afford this, so I'm looking for cheaper (better yet, free) alternatives. Also, I do wonder whether I really need Girder's functionality anyway. Girder seems aimed at users with a single simple remote, whom it enables by means of its tremendously powerful functionality to control almost anything that can receive a signal. All I want to do is control my PC, not everything on the planet! The Pronto already has a lot of built-in functionality, some of which duplicates Girder's.

 

Can I please ask if you (or anyone else reading this) knows enough about either IRAssistant or Miriam/Miri Server to advise me? To recap, I want to be able (once I've programmed my Pronto) to be able to point it at my HTPC and with one or more button-presses make it boot up, open (for example) DBV Viewer, and display on my monitor whatever channel I was last watching plus necessary controls to change channels and move around withing the DBV Viewer app. I can't ATM figure out how I can get DBVViewer to obey commands from the Pronto remote, or what commands I should program the Pronto to send to DVBViewer.

 

I'm sure I must be missing something obvious!

[Gioxy]

Tho' Girder is everywhere still being referred to as 'Freeware'

if you dig on internet you can find the latest free ver. 3.29

 

I think that most DVBViewer owner are using a Animax IR serial interface with WinLIRC (for witch DVBViewer have a built-in support); you can buy it from Technisat as separate add-on kit, it's called "Remote control set"; or, if you have some electronic mounting skill, you can delight yourself with DIY, see here...

 

What I can't know is if your Pronto remote is supported by such Animax receiver, but if your Pronto can emulate a normal TV or VCR remote, you can be sure to 100% that the Animax can perfectly receive it's signals...

[Guest Lars_MQ]

Well you can find a link to the last freeware version of girder here.

 

I personally prefer girder over winlirc cause winlirc is resticted to com-port remotes only und it's a major PIA to learn new remotes (nearly impossible as I think), you have to go and try to find a config-file from the linux pedant lirc and even then it's doesn't work smoothly.

 

With girder I had no problem to learn my remote control and the whole thing was setup in 10 minutes...

Oh and I happen to know the programmer of the DVBViewer plugin for girder, so the chances are good, that I can get functions implemented that are missing

[neophyte]

Thanks for your very helpful responses, as a result of which I now have Girder freeware v. 3.2.9 installed on my PC

 

Guys, what I don't ATM comprehend at all (and I really have tried to ) is just how Girder (or any Girder lookalike) can enable me to negotiate - say - the DVBViewer app exactly as I would if I were using a mouse and a keyboard, but using a remote instead. It's obvious I'm not going to grasp this until I start trying to use Girder and I can't do that before I've bought and installed an IR receiver.

I think that most DVBViewer owner are using a Animax IR serial interface with WinLIRC (for witch DVBViewer have a built-in support); you can buy it from Technisat as separate add-on kit, it's called "Remote control set"...

What I can't know is if your Pronto remote is supported by such Animax receiver, but if your Pronto can emulate a normal TV or VCR remote, you can be sure to 100% that the Animax can perfectly receive it's signals...

@Gloxy Are you sure they're still marketing this? I couldn't find it on their website, but anyway I wouldn't be able to use their support or read any text if it's in German, and I'm afraid Winlirc is beyond me...

 

And, yes, the Pronto can emulate any remote, by learning its IR command codes. It can then control any component that can receive IR codes and can automate entire sequences of commands by the use of macros. What it can't do on its own is control a PC. At present, I use mine to switch on my TV monitor, switch on my VCR tuner (or recorder, as desired), switch on my surround-sound preamp, navigate through the menus of all or any of these, and switch them all off. But to run any app on my HTPC - and the only apps I want to run are DVBViewer, WinDVD and Plextools - I'm currently forced to put aside my Pronto and resort to keyboard and mouse.

[Guest Lars_MQ]

but anyway I wouldn't be able to use their support or read any text if it's in German,

naah the "worst" that can happen, the site is in italian I think gioxys german is as good as my italian (no offense!)

[Gioxy]

@Lars_MQ

gioxys german is as good as my italian

surely your italian is far better!!!

 

@Neophite:

This is the english page from the Technisat for the kit I mentioned:

Remote control set

 

The Animax DIY page is (ouch, is italian!): Building a Aninmax interface

 

The stright way to control DVBViewer with a remote is:

IR Receiver -> WinLIRC -> DVBViewer

 

The way Lars_MQ propose to you is:

IR Receiver -> WinLIRC -> Girder -> Girder Plugin for DVBViewer -> DVBViewer

...so you need all, but you can control also other sw with the same Girder instance: you have only to "join" all the control command file in one...

 

BTW, have you tryed to play a DVD with DVBViewer? Unless you want to do something "special" (and I doubt you want do it with a remote!), i like more DVBViewer than WinDVD!

[Guest Lars_MQ]

IR Receiver -> WinLIRC -> Girder -> Girder Plugin for DVBViewer -> DVBViewer

No I mean

IR Receiver -> Girder with igor (for IR) & Girder Plugin for DVBViewer -> DVBViewer

 

Girder has quite a handfull of inputplugins so there is no need for winlirc (in fact the winlirc support is also a plugin) and the DVBViewerplugin for Girder is a true outputplugin for girder, it only hides some of the hardships to program girder to talk with the DVBViewer.

 

The baseline is: no matter which system you choose you will most likely be able to control the DVBViewer with it And if it's not supported, maybe we implement it directly as a inputplugin for the DVBViewer

[neophyte]

@Neophite:

BTW, have you tryed to play a DVD with DVBViewer? Unless you want to do something "special" (and I doubt you want do it with a remote!), i like more DVBViewer than WinDVD! 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

@Gioxy

No I haven't but I'll certainly give it a try. Thanks for the tip

[neophyte]

IR Receiver -> WinLIRC -> Girder -> Girder Plugin for DVBViewer -> DVBViewer

No I mean

IR Receiver -> Girder with igor (for IR) & Girder Plugin for DVBViewer -> DVBViewer

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

@Lars

Can I ask: which IR receiver? Now that at the second attempt I've found the 'remote control set' which Gioxy pointed me to, and discovered that it only costs Eur 6,99 plus VAT + postage, this represents by far the cheapest option (apart from DIY, which isn't an option for me ) I've yet encountered. What's the catch? (There's always a catch...)

 

For example, how close to it does the remote have to be, considering that (with the receiver plugged into the back of the PC) it's not in direct line of sight but is relying on indirect signals being bounced off the wall?

 

Would I be better-advised to spend more money (Eur 30 +VAT + shipping on an IRman, for instance) and get a product which has had excellent reviews - or would I in fact be getting no more for the extra money?

[Gioxy]

with the receiver plugged into the back of the PC

to move the IR receiver in front of your PC (or wherever you want) you can simply use as extensor a serial stright cable (not a "null-modem" one)...

 

The only catch with whichever IR receiver is the IR-detector work-frequency, that obviously work better if are the same of your remote (but maybe the Pronto can transmit over various carrier frequency to emulate many remotes...).

My experience, with 3 Animax made by myself, is that also with a 38KHz detector and a 33KHz remote I haven't any real problem, also pointing to the walls, in a 4x5mt room (>4mt between them); instead, different remotes lead in different results, where (for my remotes, some 12 year old) older are worser, or, that is, I had to point stright to the receiver...

 

@Lars_MQ:

Are you talking about Igor Cesko? Oh, I really apreciate his IgorPlug USB, and it seem a great serial-Animax-alternative...

Maybe neophyte whould be more satisfied with it, but I haven't any experience on it... have anyone got it?

[neophyte]

to move the IR receiver in front of your PC (or wherever you want) you can simply use as extensor a serial stright cable (not a "null-modem" one)...

 

The only catch with whichever IR receiver is the IR-detector work-frequency, that obviously work better if are the same of your remote (but maybe the Pronto can transmit over various carrier frequency to emulate many remotes...).

My experience, with 3 Animax made by myself, is that also with a 38KHz detector and a 33KHz remote I haven't any real problem, also pointing to the walls, in a 4x5mt room (>4mt between them); instead, different remotes lead in different results, where (for my remotes, some 12 year old) older are worser, or, that is, I had to point stright to the receiver...

 

@Lars_MQ:

Are you talking about Igor Cesko? Oh, I really apreciate his IgorPlug USB, and it seem a great serial-Animax-alternative...

Maybe neophyte whould be more satisfied with it, but I haven't any experience on it... have anyone got it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, I now feel a bit of an eejit (not the first time and won't be the last!) . Having today taken delivery of the Airstar2 - from DVBSHOP - I find that bundled with it is - you've guessed - Technisat's 'remote control set'. I had registered the fact when ordering that a 'remote control' was included in the price but the penny hadn't dropped before now. I just thought:-'oh that'll be handy for learning my Pronto...'

 

So now it seems I need look no further for an IR receiver since I unexpectedly own one already and shall be in a position once I've installed the AS2 to find out the answers to my own questions about its performance.

 

@Gioxy

Thanks for the tip about using an extension cable (if it's needed). Also, I have dl'd the IgorPlug Girder plugin so, yes, this is what I plan to use together with DVBViewer's Girder plugin (once I've got DVBViewer installed).

 

@both

Thanks again for all the help. I suspect I may be asking for more!

[Gioxy]

 

Yesterday I tested the remote configuration suggested by Lars_MQ and...

UAU, it work a lot better than the one's using WinLIRC!

...it's simpler, smarter, faster and adding a unknown remote is a real kids play!

 

On the other hand one have to add to Girder the support for all the prog he need to control by remote (while various prog already have builded in the WinLIRC support), but (I hope) this is only a question of time and patience...

 

@Lars_MQ: I found 2 missing command in the "Girder Plugin for DVBViewer", that are very useful for me: "Last channel" and "Show EPG info"... it is possible to add them in the .dll?

[neophyte]

IR Receiver -> WinLIRC -> Girder -> Girder Plugin for DVBViewer -> DVBViewer

No I mean

IR Receiver -> Girder with igor (for IR) & Girder Plugin for DVBViewer -> DVBViewer

 

Girder has quite a handfull of inputplugins so there is no need for winlirc (in fact the winlirc support is also a plugin) and the DVBViewerplugin for Girder is a true outputplugin for girder, it only hides some of the hardships to program girder to talk with the DVBViewer.

 

The baseline is: no matter which system you choose you will most likely be able to control the DVBViewer with it And if it's not supported, maybe we implement it directly as a inputplugin for the DVBViewer

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

@Lars_MQ

 

Girder 3.2.9 is installed on my system. The relevant files from your Girder Control Plugin (ver. 1.1) are copied into the appropriate Girder folders. Igor's plugin is loaded into Girder's plugin folder. Using WMP as a guinea-pig, I've established that Girder is able to faultlessly receive/execute commands from my remote (via the IR receiver supplied by TechniSat) to operate WMP's playback controls. But, try as I might to understand how to do the same with DVBViewer 3.2.6, I can't

 

I'm sure I must be missing something that's obvious to everyone else, but I just can't get the hang of how to connect my remote with DVBViewer by way of the Girder Control Plugin. I've read the readme.txt that comes with the plugin and printed-out the DVBViewer.ini file. Sorry to say that I just don't get it! The Readme mentions the 'send remote' command so I've also activated that in Girder, but it tells me nothing.

 

Please, tell me how, exactly, is this link accomplished? Trying to figure it out for myself is rapidly driving me nuts and I'm sure you don't want to be responsible for that.

Edited April 5, 2006 by neophyte