ISO-IEC 13818

[Dvb-tv]

Hi DVBViewer developers can you please make the output recording DVBViewer makes, ISO standardized.

 

This here link that you can start with. I find DVBViewer recordings not work correctly with a lot of other tools. That do follow to the strict ISO protocols that are set. Including just tested with new DVBViewer b3524, TSReader doesn't even see the streams correctly. Improvements to standard ISO are needed fixes for DVBViewer output recordings.

 

I record only in transport stream format. But this ISO standard covers all the main dvb formats.

 

I look foward to seeing these fixes, to make the streams to the ISO standard. So that DVBViewer recordings will work with every other software.

Edited October 17, 2006 by Dvb-tv

[Derrick]

Could you be more specific?

 

TSReader doesn't even see the streams correctly.

Tsreader only accepts TS. At least with ts_recordings made by DVBViewer, tsreader has no problems

[hackbart]

Hmm, ts files kept untouched and are recorded as is. According to PVA we used exactly the Specification and PS recording is also like it is defined in the documents. Please keep in mind that DVB is not automaticly DVD compliant, it differs from Bitrate, GOP-Size up to Resolution. If you have problems with your cut software i would recommend either ProjectX or VideoRedo. The last one is really awesome

 

Christian

[Derrick]

hmm, this adds to the confusion

 

According to PVA we used exactly the Specification

Who is talking about PVA ? PVA is not a standard !

 

and PS recording is also like it is defined in the documents.

..not quite, there are some minor syntax errors e.g. :

"MPEG 2 Video->VES(224)->Within a video sequence, all bit_rate_value shall be encoded with same value. Found differenet from value in first sequence header"

 

only th 1st header is patched when a mpeg programme stream ist recorded. But that doesn't cause any harm..

 

Hmm, ts files kept untouched and are recorded as is.

..true, but that could be questioned as well According to dvb standards this is a partial transport stream and the corresponding tables (SIT) could be included. This is used for STBs with harddisk recording. But it works perfectly well without

[Dvb-tv]

I'll add some more to this as it is, is not correct with DVBViewer. More so as i notice with my .ts recordings i make with DVBViewer.

 

 

Some further reading that will interest you for correcting this.

 

Here are some screen shots of TSReader Lite, to show the problem. The problem from what i can tell is the lack of PAT, PMT, or PCR PIDs.

 

 

http://www.DVBViewer.com/forum/style_image...e_types/gif.gif

 

 

 

The left pictureis a broadcast raw stream mux for reference.

 

Bad recordings don't fill the center of TSReader screen. With informations such as PAT and PMTs, amongst other infos.

 

The right picture is showing a DVBViewer recording that is bad.

 

 

Some more BAD Streams recorded from DVBViewer. These muxs are always recorded like this no matter what device is used. Though other software can record correctly all these multiplexs.

 

 

 

Another BAD mux.

 

Where are these new pictures I'm uploading, they dissapear to quick..

 

 

 

Ah well you get the idea, all other pictures of the other muxs. Are exactly the same as the center and the right one. I do have a good one recorded in another dtt software, though my daily alloted image upload is possibly run out on the forum. All it shows is the center column is a the first left picture is full of data. Though this never happens with DVBViewer recordings, they should but don't. Which means they are not correctly setup to ISO and other standards laid out. Hopefuly soon DVBViewer developers will fix this, sooner than later.

Edited October 18, 2006 by Dvb-tv

[Guest Lars_MQ]

The problem from what i can tell is the lack of PAT, PMT, or PCR PIDs.

I'm sorry if this may sound harsh, but I thing you should simply stop making false accusations about something you obviously don't understand completly.

 

- First the PAT is in the stream otherwise you wouldn't see any PMTs.

- second: Is the selected stream in the picture the one you recorded? I doubt it. Please look again and carefully and you will find indeed a stream (the one you recorded) with all data ok.

 

I suggest you take the transedit program and use it's analyse features and you will find yourself surprised, we really do know what we do and have all together quite some knowledge about the Iso and ETSI papers.

 

And yes Derrick is right we could do a SIT

[Dvb-tv]

I appreciate this Lars but these are the recording from DVBViewer. Except the first picture which is a snapshot of TSReader showing one mux as it is being broadcast.

 

Accusations are not meant to be harmful, i'm just needing the recordings to be perfect as they should be. And to work with all other softwares that work to the standards.

 

Most of these other programms require many instances of PAT/PMT throughout the recordings. I think with DVBViewer they are there, but is not enough at the start of the recording is what is wrong.

 

It doesn't make DVBViewer bad at all, it works as it is now but can be a whole lot better with adjustments. Many people if just using DVBViewer and say videoredo woul;d never notice the difference. Because software such as videoredo map all PID to inernal program PIDs and videoredo for example does very long scans into each recording to find these. They are there otherwise the recording would be jumping all over the place or not playing, which doesn't happen. Just for many softwares i think they need more PAT/PMTs at the start of recordings in a repeated structure.

 

By the way i just love DVBViewer a number one fan. I would not use any other software for recording. Because nothing does as nice as DVBViewer, keep up the good work and improvements.

Edited October 18, 2006 by Dvb-tv

[Derrick]

@Dvb-tv, your problem seems to be that you don't know how to interprete the results from TSReader properly. Maybe you should start reading the standards and manuals

 

 

[Derrick]

again.. I had a closer look on the 3 screen shots. There is something weird. I'd supect that you've either worked wird outdated settings or something else went wrong.

 

On the left picture TSReader shows an entire live DVB-T_multiplex from your Nova card. The DVBViewer recording in the middle is obviously lacking a PMT stream. But contrary to the PAT on the left picture, PMT_PID of program 27136 has changed from 1007 to 1008. If 1007 is the PMT_PID of your settings, DVBViewer tried to record a non existant pmt.

 

You could either work with "Automatic Channel Data Update" (Options -> TV + Radio) or keeping you settings up-to-date (e.g. by rescan). In this case you'll still be able to use or play the recording (with TSPlayer, Project.x) provided you've recorded the wanted elementary streams

 

 

[Dvb-tv]

Thank You Derrick for pointing out the changed PID to me, i had missed that totally.

 

I have rescanned and updated for the last week or two. Thinking this was broadcaster or other issue, not DVBViewer. But as there was no changed and other softwares i tried worked correctly. All i could think it could be was DVBViewer, through elimination process. I will see about manualy changing the PID for affect muxs in DVBViewer.

 

I did find about an hour ago that one mux is correct and recordings seen in all other softwares. At Last progress going to show that DVBViewer is set to the correct standards. And is well written for the correct standards.

 

Update.

I have again made a new scan and later still did a rescan.

Now both TSReader Live and TSReader File.dll is 1007 but still shown in TSReader center with no info. Except the PID is now 1007. DVBViewer edit channel has the PID correct 1007 so has picked up correct scan. But still the recordings have not enough PMT/PAT at the beggining for other softwares.

 

There is two Muxs that are correct with TSReader with plenty of start PMT/PAT. These are UK BBC1 mux and CH5 mux. These two make perfect recordings each and everytime i am trying them. But the other 4 muxs all the recordings from them have not enough PAT/PMT at the start, or other problems. It may be something else that is causing this, it just strikes me as lack of start PAT/PMTs. Or could this turn out to be an unknown bug in DVBViewer i have found.

 

What to do next - Any ideas..

Edited October 19, 2006 by Dvb-tv

[Dvb-tv]

Here are the two muxs that are good, why these are ok but the other four bad is a complete mystery. Have checked all PID chaanels again with TSReader in Live broadcast mode and File.dll mode. All channel recording now match each other. But still have two muxs good 4 muxs bad. Output from dvbExplorer v3 build 56 as a test makes perfect recordings of all muxes. These are seen in TSReader File.dll as they should do, just like the attached images below. But with DVBViewer it is not the same, i think its a bug or something i have found.

 

 

Here are the two muxs that are good, why these are ok but the other four bad is a complete mystery. Have checked all PID chaanels again with TSReader in Live broadcast mode and File.dll mode. All channel recording now match each other. But still have two muxs good 4 muxs bad. Output from dvbExplorer v3 build 56 as a test makes perfect recordings of all muxes. These are seen in TSReader File.dll as they should do, just like the attached images below. But with DVBViewer it is not the same, i think its a bug or something i have found.

 

BBC Mux________________CH5 Mux

;

Edited October 19, 2006 by Dvb-tv

[Derrick]

I don't quite understand.. ..are all 6 muxes from all 6 broadcast channels ok with TSReader in live mode? How is reception with DVBViewer on the 4 "bad" frequencies? I can't receive your terr. network. It is very important that you use correct dvb-t settings corresponding to your network.

[Dvb-tv]

I don't quite understand.. ..are all 6 muxes from all 6 broadcast channels ok with TSReader in live mode? How is reception with DVBViewer on the 4 "bad" frequencies? I can't receive your terr. network. It is very important that you use correct dvb-t settings corresponding to your network.

All 6 muxes from all 6 broadcat channels are 100% with TSReader Live mode.

 

Reception is 100% with all 6 muxes in DVBViewer.

 

I use correct settings, drivers, filters everything.

Edited October 22, 2006 by Dvb-tv

[Derrick]

I can't spot a problem. Could you upload a short ts recording of a single channel from one of the "bad" muxes together with the xml of the mux from transedit?

[emmel]

Hm.. If video, audio and pcr are present in the recording, it means pmt has been parsed correctly, which means that pat has been parsed correctly, I have never experienced a problem with DVBV TS-output, it has always worked 100% correctly for me.

 

Missing pat would be a true surprise. Have you tried ProjectX to analyze the stream? Or DBVsnoop? Or write a 10-line program, and check the pids your self?

Edited October 20, 2006 by emmel

[Dvb-tv]

Hm.. If video, audio and pcr are present in the recording, it means pmt has been parsed correctly, which means that pat has been parsed correctly, I have never experienced a problem with DVBV TS-output, it has always worked 100% correctly for me.

 

Missing pat would be a true surprise. Have you tried ProjectX to analyze the stream? Or DBVsnoop? Or write a 10-line program, and check the pids your self?

Emmel have you got that 10 line program you could post here or pm.

 

I can't spot a problem. Could you upload a short ts recording of a single channel from one of the "bad" muxes together with the xml of the mux from transedit?

Yes where do i upload ftp..

 

Or to use a fileserver site like yousend or other..

 

Which..

[emmel]

Emmel have you got that 10 line program you could post here or pm.

There. That should reveal if pat and pmt are present in a valid ts-file

beginning with a valid start code. Usage: gcc a.c && a.exe file.ts

Check details from the standards, in case of problems.

 

#include<stdio.h>
#include<stdlib.h>
int main(int argc,char **argv) {
 unsigned char pack[188]; int pid;
 FILE *ts=fopen(argv[1],"rb");
 while(!feof(ts)) {
fread(&pack,1,188,ts);
printf("pid=%d\n",pid=(pack[1]<<8|pack[2])&0x1fff);
if(pid==0) {
  int length=(pack[6]<<8|pack[7])&0x0fff;
  printf(" pat found (length=%d):\n",length);
  int p=12;
  while(p<length+13 && p<188) { // assume short pat
int program=(pack[++p]<<8|pack[++p])&0xffff;
int pmt=(pack[++p]<<8|pack[++p])&0x1fff;
printf(" program=%d -> pmt=%d\n",program,pmt);
  }
}
 }
}

[Dvb-tv]

Thanks Emmel for the code, i though it was going to be a .bat file or an exe.

 

I don't have any C or other compiler programs, with not needing them. Have you got an exe you can upload.