peterp Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 (edited) I wrote a small program to extract transponder INI files from the TransEdit XML output and found these issues: - XML is invalid because of " characters in the <ASCII> element: <Descriptor HValue="0x83" Name="User defined"> <DescriptorLength Value="16"/> <Data Dump="79 36 FD A8 79 40 FD A6 79 2C FC 69 79 22 FC DC"/> <ASCII String="y6 y@ y, iy" "/> </Descriptor> - "Cable delivery system" descriptor seems to be ignored and wrong frequency is shown with the transponder: <TransportstreamID Value="101" Name="538000 KHz"> // should show 770000 <OriginalNetworkID Value="2249" Name="CAIW"/> ... <Descriptor HValue="0x44" Name="Cable Delivery System"> <DescriptorLength Value="11"/> <Frequency Value="770000" Unit="KHz"/> <FECOuter Value="2" Name="RS(204/188)"/> <Modulation Value="3" Name="64 QAM"/> <Symbolrate Value="6900"/> <FECInner Value="15" Name="No conv. coding"/> </Descriptor> - "KHz" is not correct, should be lower case 'k' (kHz). I attached the unmodified TransEdit XML output. regards, Peter Edited January 5, 2011 by peterp 1 Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Thanks for the report. I'll try to fix it. It would be helpful to have a TS sample for testing. It should contain PAT, all PMTs, SDT and NIT. Can you record it with the Analyzer and upload it somewhere? Quote Link to comment
Gioxy Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Hi peterp, hi Griga and Happy New Year! I'm very interested on extraction of the descriptor "0x83", it's the one that carry the LCN information, here in Italy very important for automatic DVB-T channels ordering... I don't think it's data has to be managed as ASCII string as I found that his interpretations is (using your sample as example, "79 36 FD A8 79 40 FD A6 79 2C FC 69 79 22 FC DC"): 79 36 = Channel Service ID (called in TrensEdit "0x7936") FD = stream type: FC for SD channels, FD for HD A8 = LCN Channel number in hex, in that case LCN=168 79 40 = other Channel Service ID FD = it's a HD Channel A6 = LCN is 166 79 2C = other Channel Service ID FC = SD stream 69 = LCN is 105 79 22 = other Channel Service ID FC = SD stream DC = LCN is 220 I hope someday channel's LCN value can be - at least - added as new column in Transedit's Scanner result page, here in Italy it would be very helpful... ...I'm rather wonder how peterp can extract the whole TransEdit scan (all transponders) in a unique XML output; is it possible in a unique step? Quote Link to comment
Gioxy Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Mmmh, further investigation on 0x83 data interpretation lead me to search the Web for more, and I found this pdf file that explain it more clearly and exactly... (although my simpler - ...manual - interpretation will work if LCN<255...) Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 The LCN decriptor has been specified by EACEM (European Association of Consumer Electronics Manufacturers). According to the ETSI DVB specifications a descriptor with tag 0x83 is a "user defined" descriptor, which means, it may have a different meaning and syntax in different networks. Only relying on the descriptor tag 0x83 may cause TransEdit to display crap, if it is some other descriptor. However, the LCN descriptor can be identified by additionally checking for a private_data_specifier_descriptor with the registered EACEM private_data_specifier. And that's where things get a bit complicated... again, a sample TS file would be helpful (see my posting above). Quote Link to comment
Gioxy Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Here we are! I write 3sec TS file with requested PIDs for the main Italians DVB-T providers: RAI, Mediaset and TIMB... Many thanks Griga for your interest in it! Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Thanks. That's how it looks like. Unfortunately there is no private_data_specifier_descriptor present. So there are two possibilities: Leave it like it was or decode the 0x83 descriptor and see where it goes wrong P.S. They are also using it in Australia (PDF). Quote Link to comment
Gioxy Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 ...maybe some TransEdit options differs, this is how it looks to me (TE 3.6.1.0): ...and in the selected row I can interpret: "00 8D FC 05" ie CANALE 5, SD TV, LCN = 5 (as espected) "00 8E FC 06" ie ITALIA 1, SD TV, LCN = 6 ( " ) "00 8F FC 04" ie RETE 4, SD TV, LCN = 4 ( " ) "00 91 FC 28" ie Boing, SD TV, LCN = 40 ( " ) ...and so on... As far as I have read until now the Australian data organization is the same (see Table 1) and obviously the allocation/meaning of the LCN numbers differs (here you can find the italian one) where Italians are meaningless except for channels ordering, so what wa care about is only which ordinal number have each channel... (BTW, if you need I'll post the same image for the other 2 providers, or XML exports if you'd prefer...) Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 maybe some TransEdit options differs, I've added the descriptor parsing yesterday, that's all Quote Link to comment
Gioxy Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 I've added the descriptor parsing yesterday, that's all WOW! ...I'm really sorry, I didn't realize that you've already done it! (I thought you complained about the lack of "data" line in .TS files... ) I'll be very glad to deeply test this TE ver. for Italian DVB-T providers and report the results in a proper tread... A big big thanks! Quote Link to comment
Gioxy Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 P.S. They are also using it in Australia ...and also in many other countries as wiki report, eg: UK actual LCN, FR DVB-T Specs and samples (LCN info pag. 62-)... Other useful info: Italian official DVB-T Specs (LCN info pag. 33-), a informative forum post about LCN Quote Link to comment
brildi Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 (edited) Hello, Why in DVBViewer 4.5 it is correctly displayed DiSEqC command scripts, but in TransEdit 3.6.1 it is not correct? Configuration folder everywhere identical. DiSEqC.xml and TransEdit.ini attached. DiSEqC.xml TransEdit.ini Edited January 8, 2011 by brildi Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Why in DVBViewer 4.5 it is correctly displayed DiSEqC command scripts, but in TransEdit 3.6.1 it is not correct? What is your local decimal separator? <entry name="Latitude">50.4</entry> Reading your DiSEqC.xml fails in TransEdit if the local decimal separator is not a dot. In Germany it's a comma, and TransEdit can't read your DiSEqC.xml here either. It works after replacing the decimal separator in your file by a comma. Quote Link to comment
brildi Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 TYVM. My local decimal separator - comma. I change decimal separator and all correct. Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 The basic problem is that DVBViewer always uses a dot when writing the DiSEqC.xml, regardless of the local separator However, DVBViewer accepts dots and commas when reading the file. TransEdit only accepts the local separator. So for now, better use TransEdit for changing the DiSEqC.xml. I will try to make TransEdit more fail-proof in this respect. Quote Link to comment
peterp Posted January 25, 2011 Author Share Posted January 25, 2011 (edited) Thanks for the report. I'll try to fix it. It would be helpful to have a TS sample for testing. It should contain PAT, all PMTs, SDT and NIT. Can you record it with the Analyzer and upload it somewhere? I have been away for some time, sorry for the delay. Here is a recording of two channels (CAIWAY and REKAM provider). Peter Edited January 25, 2011 by peterp 1 Quote Link to comment
Derrick Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 - "Cable delivery system" descriptor seems to be ignored and wrong frequency is shown with the transponder: <TransportstreamID Value="101" Name="538000 KHz"> // should show 770000 <OriginalNetworkID Value="2249" Name="CAIW"/> TransportstreamID = 101 is also valid for 770MHz but with NetworkID = 4683 - CAIW Midden-Holland The structure is rather complicated but for certified stbs there are downloads for the corresponding bouquets. Except for Tid=102 in the example the SI seems straightforward. Will the westland_tomatoes grow faster and bigger when you play church radio (Kerk TV/Radio) Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Thanks for providing the (late) samples. <TransportstreamID Value="101" Name="538000 KHz"> // should show 770000 I think the issue is fixed now: http://www.DVBViewer.tv/forum/topic/2745-transedit/page__view__findpost__p__324903 - Fix: The Original Network ID (ONID) overriding the Network ID (NID) in the Network Information Table (NIT) could cause wrong frequency assignments in the SI Table Tree. ...but I couldn't test it without a sample. I don't see such an issue in your samples anymore, but I can't find the former wrong entry there either. Please check it with TransEdit 3.6.3. Quote Link to comment
peterp Posted January 26, 2011 Author Share Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) Transponder frequency and XML quote issues are fixed. I tested it with v3.6.3. However, I found a possible mistake in naming the OriginalNetworkID: In the NIT Other tree, under any NetworkID, under a TransportstreamID, there is a OriginalNetworkID with the correct number, but with a wrong name. The name is taken from the respective NetworkID-Other section. Example <NIT PID="16" Name="Actual"> <NetworkID Value="2249" Name="CAIW"/> // Correct <NIT PID="16" Name="Other"> <NetworkID Value="8378" Name="CAIW Test intern"> <Descriptor HValue="0x40" Name="Network Name"> <DescriptorLength Value="16"/> <NetworkName String="CAIW Test intern"/> </Descriptor> <TransportstreamID Value="101" Name="538000 kHz"> <OriginalNetworkID Value="2249" Name="CAIW Test intern"/> // Name does not match the ID, should be "CAIW" <NetworkID Value="2250" Name="CAIW Basic-pakket"> <Descriptor HValue="0x40" Name="Network Name"> <DescriptorLength Value="17"/> <NetworkName String="CAIW Basic-pakket"/> </Descriptor> <TransportstreamID Value="101" Name="538000 kHz"> <OriginalNetworkID Value="2249" Name="CAIW Basic-pakket"/> // Name does not match the ID, should be "CAIW" <NetworkID Value="4683" Name="CAIW Midden-Holland"> <Descriptor HValue="0x40" Name="Network Name"> <DescriptorLength Value="19"/> <NetworkName String="CAIW Midden-Holland"/> </Descriptor> <TransportstreamID Value="101" Name="770000 kHz"> <OriginalNetworkID Value="2249" Name="CAIW Midden-Holland"/> // Name does not match the ID, should be "CAIW" Edited January 26, 2011 by peterp Quote Link to comment
Griga Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Confirmed. I didn't consider all consequences of the transponder frequency fix. Now the NetworkID overrides the OriginalNetworkID when the name is assigned to it. I can see it in your sample However, it only takes one additional line to get it right. Quote Link to comment
PeterF Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 However, it only takes one additional line to get it right. @Griga, if you change one line, can you add that also in DVB-T will shown the Modulation, here in Berlin they are using two different ones and it would be nice to see the Modulation in tne teble or in the analyzer.(Griga, wenn du schon eine Zeile änderst, ist es dir da möglich auch für DVB-T die Modulation in der Tabelle und im Analyzer anzeigen zu lassen? Hintergrund ist der, hier in Berlin werden momentan 2 verschiedene genutzt, und es wäre schön das auch angezeigt zu bekommen. PeterF Quote Link to comment
Derrick Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 have a look at > Descriptor = 0x5A - Terrestrial Delivery System Quote Link to comment
PeterF Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Yes that is what i meant, "Constellation Value="1" Name="16-QAM"", but i would prefer if it was like in DVB-S and DVB-C on the top of the page and in the transponder-table. Ja diese Daten meinte ich, aber ist es möglich diese auch wie bei den anderen Empfangsarten im Analyzerfenster links oben unter/als Modulation anzeigen zu lassen und eventuell auch in der Starttabelle mit den Transponderdaten? PeterF Quote Link to comment
Derrick Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 The tuner (scan) only needs frequency and channel bandwidth. The analyzer shows all available additional parameters. Quote Link to comment
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