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Mostly Harmless

EPG don't work correctly

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Mostly Harmless

it's easier to show than explain.

the epg shows mostly nothing.

sometimes part of the guide is visible, then in another time with the same channels it is not.

it worked correctly with earlier versions (4.5, 4.6).

other software shows the epg correctly, so it's not the provider's fault.

post-112036-0-66263000-1333539798_thumb.jpg

support.zip

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Mostly Harmless

No answer? Great.

I'm kinda disappointed with the support of this PAID software. If it was a freeware, I couldn't say a thing, but it's not, I'VE PAID FOR IT. In DVBViewer Pro, the EPG does not work as it is expected.

However in DVBViewer GE it works flawlessly (as seen in attached image), so it's not the cable provider's fault.

Please explain that.

post-112036-0-27962900-1362131398_thumb.jpg

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Griga
so it's not the cable provider's fault.

It can't be DVBViewer's fault either, because here it shows no such EPG issue on four satellite positions plus DVB-T. So who is left to blame? Sorry, my dear friend, only you! :)

 

Ok, without kidding now: Most likely it's the provider's fault, as explained here:

 

http://www.DVBViewer.tv/forum/topic/49616-long-standing-epg-bug-hong-kong-tvb/page__view__findpost__p__367525

 

You will only see it after having used a DVBViewer installation for more than one day. Lately I have implemented measures against this kind of misbehaviour in DVBViewer GE, but it's more or less experimental. Unfortunately I can't test it in "real life", because among the providers that I can receive there is none who messes the EPG Event IDs up in the described way.

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Mostly Harmless

Could you use DVBViewer GE's method in DVBViewer Pro's next version too? Pretty please? :) Even by a hidden option in tweaker.exe or anything? It works flawlessly. Also, Terratec's OEM version, which replaced their own software, shows EPG correctly, just Pro doesn't. And that's it makes me sad, because now I see it's not an impossible thing.

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Lars_MQ

Maybe, we'll have to evaluate this in depth. Might take a lot of time, since it's low priority. 15€ only go so far...

But you can always complain to your provider, to fix their problems, I'm sure you spend more money there one way or the other... :)

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Mostly Harmless

Maybe, we'll have to evaluate this in depth. Might take a lot of time, since it's low priority. 15€ only go so far...

But you can always complain to your provider, to fix their problems, I'm sure you spend more money there one way or the other... :)

 

I already tried that, it's hopeless. They can't solve even simpler problems than this. :(

And since the EPG works well on their proprietary set-top box (also!) they say the fault is not on their end...

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Griga
Could you use DVBViewer GE's method in DVBViewer Pro's next version too?

First it has to be verified that you are encountering the assumed problem. Check the following:

 

- Close DVBViewer Pro, delete the file epg.dat in the configuration folder, restart DVBViewer Pro. The freshly received EPG should now be ok. The issue only raises its ugly head after an EPG update.

 

- Does DVBViewer GE display the EPG correctly over several days?

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Mostly Harmless

- I deleted the epg.dat as you suggested and the refreshed EPG now seems ok. Now by your theory the problem will reoccur in 24 hours...

nope. by the time i finished this message, there are already holes in the EPG. DVBViewer GE still good tough...

 

- I only tried DVBViewer GE yesterday for the first time after a fellow user who experienced the same problem mentioned in a PM that it works well for him. So I can answer that in a few days...

 

thank you for looking into the problem. I really appreciate that.

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Casual

Hey guys

 

First. My english is very bad but I hope u will understand me.

 

I wanna report same epg error.

 

TEST with DVBViewer GE:

IT WORKS!

post-136896-0-83408300-1362225606_thumb.jpg

All epg data loaded into epg window.(w00t)

 

TEST with 5.0 PRO:

DOESNT WORKS!

I did delete the epg.dat from my config folder and then i try to get fresh program guide. I always get something like this:

post-136896-0-89607400-1362225915_thumb.jpg

Note: My EPG cannot update correctly when I click "Start EPG Scan" in Rec Service.

 

Solution?

I think the problem is here:

Changelog DVBViewer Pro 4.5.0.0

Change: PAT/PMT and EPG tables will now be CRC32 checked to avoid problems with wrong data (cause by bad reception).

Mmm....Can I disable this CRC checking? or any other idea, pls?

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Casual

i wanna show an another screenshot. Check it pls!

yx7958v9jt0qu8kknxu_thumb.jpg

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Griga
PAT/PMT and EPG tables will now be CRC32 checked

DVBViewer GE does it also.

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Casual

I did some more tests with EPG over the last few months:

ProgDVB - OK

SmartDVB - OK

DVBViewer GE - OK

DVBViewer PRO - FAIL

 

Why?

Can u help us whats the difference between the PRO and the GE?

Any ideas how to solve it?

:huh:

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Mostly Harmless

After trying for a couple of days, I can say, DVBViewer GE's EPG works flawlessly any time. I DVBViewer Pro's EPG would work in a similar fashion, I'd be a happy man.

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Mostly Harmless

This problem is still unresolved.

The EPG is faulty in DVBViewer Pro (see picture)

post-112036-0-08886400-1391256870_thumb.jpg

but works correctly in DVBViewer GE.

post-112036-0-16325000-1391256868_thumb.jpg

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blasgl

can you post a current support.zip

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Derrick

I doubt that a support.zip could reveal any new information. I guess it's just a reminder ;)

AFAIK in the mentime nothing has been done to tackle the problem in RS and Pro.

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Mostly Harmless

can you post a current support.zip

 

I don't know if it helps, but...

support.zip

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Derrick

If you use the RS you should disable the hardware devices in the DVBViewer and replace them by virtual devices (Unicast, RTSP).

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Mostly Harmless

If you use the RS you should disable the hardware devices in the DVBViewer and replace them by virtual devices (Unicast, RTSP).

 

I don't really see what good it would make.

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Derrick

..e.g. the EPG-Updater could collide with the DVBViewer when you open the DVBV :rolleyes:

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Mostly Harmless

..e.g. the EPG-Updater could collide with the DVBViewer when you open the DVBV :rolleyes:

 

okay, I uninstalled RS and the EPG in DVBViewer Pro is still not good... now what?

(however, the EPG is always good in DVBViewer GE, whether the service is installed or not.)

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Derrick

 

the EPG in DVBViewer Pro is still not good... now what?

I already wrote that a support.zip is of no use cos nothing has been changed EPG wise since your 1st post. But now that you have added the file, I took a look for a possible misconfiguration :)

Nothing to do with the EPG problem. Maybe it would be more promising to convince your cable provider to use stable event_id.

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Mostly Harmless

then why, oh why does the EPG work correctly in GE?

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majstang

I know when having these kind of severe epg troubles you want it fixed asap and the last thing you wanna hear is there are alternatives for you that would require some work and reading up. Use WG++ and download the EPG from an external websource and import the XMLTV into RS with XEPG: http://www.a123.dk/

WG++ here: http://www.webgrabplus.com/

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quack

Hi there,

 

this issue is still unresolved.

I use ProgDVB and DVBViewer pro (6.2.0), ProgDVB displays the EPG just fine while DVBViewer displays nothing, as if it could not extract the EPG from the ip multicast stream.

My IPTV provider is Orange. It's a major TV operator here in France, it would be very nice if you could do something to finally make the EPG work with multicast after all these years.

 

I can provide anything you need to help (capture of the streams, ...)

 

 

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Tjod

Are you using the TS stream device or the IPTV device? best solution you post a support.zip

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quack

I'm using a DVB IPTV Device.

Here it the support.zip

 

support.zip

Edited by quack

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Tjod

Can you check with TransEdit if there is the normal DVB EPG in the stream.

Select the transponder list for Orange then select a "transponder" (IP and port combination).

Click on Analyzer and look "ETI" appear there (where PAT etc. is).

 

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quack

yes there is:

 

dOQP0aH.jpg

 

but all these EPG information don't appear in powerdvb

 

Edited by quack

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Tjod

OK right click in the right part of the window.

"Select Main SI PIDs" and then Start Recording at the bottom of the window.

And stop the recording after around 30-40 sec. (the recording is saved in the folder specified in settings > Analyser).

zip and upload the recording and post the link here or send the link to me via PM.

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Griga

That's the problem:

 

Zwischenablage01.png

 

The broadcaster does not follow the DVB specifications. The Network ID in the EPG (167) doesn't match the Network ID of the channel (1). That's why DVBViewer can't assign EPG data to the channel. You can try to work around this problem by performing the following steps:

  1. Open TV/Radio -> Channel Editor
  2. Select one of the channels.
  3. On the right side, tick the "Don't update automatically" checkbox at the bottom and set the Network ID to 0 (which is a kind of wildcard matching all Network IDs).
  4. Click Apply.
  5. Retune the channel by double-clicking it and check if you can see the EPG on the EPG Window ->  EPG per Channel tab.
  6. If yes repeat step 2...4 for each channel.

"Don't update automatically" can also be set for all channels within a category folder (select the folder and have a look on the right side), but not the Network ID. If the Network ID is 1 for all channels, you can change it by exporting you channel list as INI file, using search & replace in a text editor to replace it by NetworkID=0 and re-importing it. Please ask for further instructions if necessary.

 

The drawback of this method is that DVBViewer doesn't update channels automatically anymore if the channel data changes. Scanning will perform an update, but set the Network ID back to its original value. Maybe we can find a better handling for such cases in future. I will think about it....

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quack

Hi Griga,

 

thank you,

I have to say that I'm not surprised at all, Orange never respects any standards and RFCs. They do things their way.

I did what you suggested and it is now working for this channel and many others.

 

Unfortunately, it's still not working for some others. I think this may be due to the TransportStreamID which is not matching (the transportstreamid in the EPG is 2 while the streamID of the channel is 1). I tried to change the streamId to 0 in the channel editor but it doesn't work, maybe 0 doesn't work as a wildcard  as it does for networkId

 

Here is the screenshot of transedit showing this:

jvdBQK5.png

 

and the capture of the EPGs if this can help

 

 

 

Orange 07-15 10-09-35.zip

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Griga

Transportstream ID = 0 can't be used as wildcard, but you can set it to 2 if required for the EPG.

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quack

It does indeed work with TransportStreamId set to 2 for this particular channel.

 

I have some questions:

- what are these 2 properties networkID and transportStreamId really used for ? Is it just to "recognize" the channel if the provider decides to change the source IP ?

 

- what are the downside of manually editing this properties (except what you already explained for networkid) ? More specifically, do I risk to "break" something if I manually edit the TransportStreamId of all my channels or in my case is it just used to "filter" the EPG data ?

 

- last, and it is more a feature request than a question, is it possible to add an option in powerDVB to automatically "associate" all EPGs embedded in the channel stream regardless of networkId and transportStreamId ? It's probably what ProgDVB is doing btw because the EPG is working "by default". Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it is "better" because it doesn't probably respect the DVB specs, but it's clearly more user friendly. What is the added value of checking the networkId and transportStreamId ? Maybe the original purpose was to allow one channel to "push" EPG of other channels but is it used ? Clearly for me the dumbest solution would be the best. Would you mind considering this possibility please ?

 

 

Edited by quack

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Griga
4 hours ago, quack said:

- what are these 2 properties networkID and transportStreamId really used for ?

 

Every DVB element has a "path", like files in a file system. Network ID (numerical ID of a DVB network, e.g. a cable provider or a satellite position) -> Transportstream ID (numerical ID of a transport stream within the network) -> Service ID (numerical ID of a service or channel within the transport stream) -> Elementary Stream PID (numerical Packet Identifier of an element belonging to the service, e.g. Video, Audio, Subtitles...).

 

EPG data is broadcasted with the path of the service to which the data belongs, so it can be assigned to it unambigiously. Please read more about it here, particularly about the EIT. After this you will be a DVB expert and we can continue... :)

 

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quack

Thank you for this "tutorial", it was very helpful.

 

Now, I know what Network, TransportStream, Services, PID, ... are.

But it doesn't really solve my issue.

 

First, I noticed some more inconsistencies: in the SDT PID, both EITScheduleFlag and EITPresentFollowingFlag are 0.

Despite the fact that the EIT PID is present will the present and following program list.

 

In the EIT PID, the OriginalNetworkID is 167 which corresponds to hex 0x00A7 which is FranceTelecom Globecast (holding of Orange). Seems legit except that it doesn't follow the DVB specs.

And I cannot understand why the TransportStreamID in the EIT PID is 2 instead of 1.

 

Anyway, I still don't get the point of these NetworkID and transportStreamID in my situation of IPTV Device. One transponder = 1 IP Address and there is only 1 network and 1 transportStream per transponder.

I guess the situation is totally different when using a satellite (though I don't really know because I have no real life example to figure it out) but when using an IPTV Device, the networkId and transportStreamID of the EIT PID should be ignored (and I guess this is what other DVB Programs do because they display the EPG "by default")

 

What do you think ?

 

Edited by quack

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Griga
On 16.7.2017 at 2:57 PM, quack said:

And I cannot understand why the TransportStreamID in the EIT PID is 2 instead of 1.

 

Looks like they have compiled SI tables from different sources without really adjusting it to IPTV conditions. Maybe the EPG data in the EIT originates from satellite, terrestrial or cable broadcasts, don't know.

 

On 16.7.2017 at 2:57 PM, quack said:

One transponder = 1 IP Address and there is only 1 network and 1 transportStream per transponder.

I guess the situation is totally different when using a satellite

 

There is always one transport stream per transponder, but satellite, terrestrial or cable transport streams usually contain more than one service. Multiple channels are "muxed" in the transport stream. However, IPTV transport streams usually contain only a single channel.

 

So in your case the "EIT Actual TS, Present/Following" section should only contain EPG data for this channel, not useless data for other services that are not present in the actual transport stream. If such data is broadcasted it should be present in the "EIT other TS, Present/Following" section, but in this case at least the Transportstream ID must be used consistently. Otherwise it is impossible to assign the data to channels.

 

On 16.7.2017 at 2:57 PM, quack said:

when using an IPTV Device, the networkId and transportStreamID of the EIT PID should be ignored (and I guess this is what other DVB Programs do because they display the EPG "by default")

 

That's the point. In your case the only reliable ID seems to be the Service ID, so reducing EPG -> channel assignment to only comparing the Service ID would probably fix the EPG issues.

 

However, we have to be very careful with such changes since DVBViewer is used in many different ways. E.g. there are people who import EPG data from external sources by using Xepg because the native IPTV EPG is quite poor, and in this case a "Service ID only" comparison could cause wrong assignments. And we don't know how other IPTV networks are handling the EPG data. We even don't know exactly how the Orange IPTV network is handling EPG data because up to now I've only seen the content of a single transport stream. How do the others look like? Moreover, we can't receive French IPTV, so we can't test if a change really makes it work.

 

Generally spoken a change that fixes issues here may cause other issues there, that's the problem. That's why I've written "I will think about it...." It can't be solved by easy measures from one day to the next.

 

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quack

I completely agree with you, quick & dirty patches to make something work in a rush is never a good thing.

 

I'm glad you will think about it but it would be very nice if you could come up with a solution at some point because I don't know the situation in germany or in the us but here in france, satellite in slowly being decommissioned to be replaced by IPTV.

 

I personally own DVBViewer and ProgDVB but I prefer DVBViewer so it makes me sad when ProgDVB is providing EPG services while DVBViewer isn't...

 

I know that I can use external programs such as Xepg (and I have used it for some time) but I don't like the idea of launching external programs to fetch the EPG Data...

 

From now, I consider that everything has been said about this so I won't ask again but I'll be waiting for new releases and hope to have a good surprise at some point :)

 

 

Edited by quack

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dtaurus

Hello,

 

I have a problem with the EPG that suddenly disappeared, and the file epg.dat is created every time I delete it.

 

I tried to reinstall DVBViewer pro, did not give results.


Is there any solution?

 

Spoiler

noepg.jpg

 

 

Edited by dtaurus

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