Multicasting with DVB Viewer

[leadbelly]

Folks, I’m new to this forum and I can appreciate this question may have been asked before, but so far can find, there is nothing about it on the Forum…

 

I want to setup several PC’s with SkyStar 2 cards installed, and stream Sky and some sports stuff for a big client I support. (It’s a sweetener)

 

Question is, has anyone ever streamed more than one channel over a LAN (using DVBViewer and SkyStar 2’s) The new network is fiber so it shouldn’t impact too much.

 

I noticed in the DVBViewer documentation that you should never change the port from 7789 I think it was. Why?

 

Anyone tried using other ports? (For stacking) Or used more than 1 SkyStar card on the same domain? (will it work?)

 

This setup will be primarily for streaming in Multicast mode..

 

I’d welcome any comments and help..

 

Cheers

Leadbelly

[Guest Oliver]

I noticed in the DVBViewer documentation that you should never change the port from 7789 I think it was. Why?

I wanted it to be foolproof. Well, it's no problem to stream more than one channel, though.

 

7792 is the currently tuned channel, the other numbers are displayed by the Multicast plugin. You need to setup the client application for different ports.

 

http://www.DVBViewer.com/oliver/plugins.html#multicast

 

BTW: The next release of the DVBViewer Pro will feature completely new streaming functions.

 

Bye, Oliver

[leadbelly]

Thanks Oliver,

 

 

I was more concerned it wasn’t going to work the price of these cards makes this a real nice setup

 

OK well I think its time to go buy 8 SkyStar2 cards and get building those servers, I’ll build the servers with 2 Gb RAM its cheap at the moment too…

 

Thanks Oliver glad to know its not going to be an issue with 6 or 8 cards running on the same network…

 

Will let you know how I get one..

 

Cheers

Leadbelly

[Guest Oliver]

Thanks Oliver glad to know its not going to be an issue with 6 or 8 cards running on the same network…

Erm, the current solution is designed to stream from one server to one or more clients. I've never tested it with more than one SS2, though. Perhaps you could elaborate a bit about your planned setup?

 

Bye, Oliver

[leadbelly]

Thanks Oliver,

 

OK System spec:

 

1Gigabit network, DNS server, server for DHCP Server for Back office

16 users in total, on the network (XP), 8 users want access to channels on hot bird, all at same time, so if one is watching say CNN, another maybe watching NBC, another Bloomberg, another Sky News, another TV5 France, another maybe Pro7..(all in separate offices, I may add, and all on separate PC’s)

 

I have to run a minimum of 6 user streams all the time, so if there is a feed of financial interest on say Bloomberg one will call the other and, everyone will switch to Bloomberg...

 

So in essence I need to make available a minimum of 6 Individual streams as there are 6 independent financial advisors, however 3 of them are from Europe so they also want to be able to watch there home news during working hours, hence the French and German channels.

 

Hope you understand what I’m trying to make up for them…I had counted on fitting 6 SkyStar 2 cards in 6 separate servers, but I was concerned that there could be problems, but as you say all I need do is give each server a different IP address, I can still use the same port 7792 (thanks) but each server will be independently available over the LAN.

 

I think I have just about covered everything, so what do you think Oliver? Will it work?

 

 

Thanks for your help

Leadbelly

[Klausing]

do you mean thenew TechniSAT Edition?

[leadbelly]

Klausing, yes indeed I mean the new SkyStar2 PCI cards..

[Klausing]

new dirver not new PCI Cards! There exist no new PCI cards!

[leadbelly]

Sorry Klausing, I have not purchased any hardware as yet, or indeed software, that is one of the reasons I was asking if anyone had tried this concept out.

 

Thank you

Leadbelly

[Klausing]

multicast allows to all users (thousands if you want ) to show TV. But it makes a lot of network traffic.

Your network must be able to handle this.The only problem is , they can only watch stations from the same transponder.

With DVBViewerTechniSat Edition you can stream only one station, but with DVBViewerPro (15Euro) you can stream a whole transponder with all stations on it. The only thing what the clients need is a VLC to recieve the stream. If you want to get stations from a different transponder you need a Mediaserver for every transponder. there is no driver/programm which can handle 8 cards in one pc.

here you can read more about the multicast Plugin.

 

BTW A whole transponder makes nearly 30MB/s traffic 8 transponders makes 240MB/s traffic..... I believe this is a little bit to much for your network.

let us know if you make it real !

 

Steffen

[Guest hackbart]

next release has some unicast solution which is able to broadcast even hdtv data to differen ip's without multicasting it. I tested it on my wlan system and it worked fine... So be curious for the next release

 

Christian

[leadbelly]

next release has some unicast solution which is able to broadcast even hdtv data to differen ip's without multicasting it. I tested it on my wlan system and it worked fine... So be curious for the next release 

 

Christian

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

OK… I could do with some pointers here guys.

 

I have the latest FULL version installed on both the server and client machine, I’m a little confused as to the nature of the separate DVB Server application, and the multicasting plug-in for DVBViewer… which option guys, plug in or blue orb server application…

 

What I have managed so far:

I can multicast with some success using the DVBViewer application, by install the Multicast plug-in, I choose a transponder, chose multicast, and select some channels, and using TSReader I can see a valid TS & PIDs

 

I’m broadcasting… VLC works 100% on the client PCs

 

FYI Settings used so far on the server are 238.0.0.1 port 1234 (additional channels check box ticks 1235, 1236 & 1237) Multicasting 3 channels yeah? So far so good, everyone with me so far?

 

OK silly question, but one that’s not detailed in the Manuals or indeed on any posts here is what to expect from DVBViewer when selecting other channels on the client PC

 

So far…

By running up a full version of DVBViewer on the client machine, (Direct-x, Multicast network device, settings, enter in the Multicast address of the server on the lower section marked DVB Multicast as above (238.0.0.1) and then the first port/channel (1235)) Bingo I can get a picture, excellent quality, fantastic…

ok when I want to view one of the other channels that’s also being streamed I get nothing, the only way to get this to work is to open up DVBViewer (client PC) again and change the port address in this case from 1235 up to 1236… then close (EXIT) DVBViewer, then start it up again and now select the new channel with respect to the port number on the server… Bingo this works fine. (I’ve also copied over the channel lists from the server, so that everything is identical)

 

Can anyone tell me what to expect with the DVBViewer application here, should I be able to just change channels up and down on the client application? Should this change the port respectively up and down using the TS PIDs? How’s this supposed to work?

 

Additionally I’ve also tried the following:

using the blue orb server application located on the server PC, if I set this up as per the manual nothing works, no stream nothing… however if I leave the blue orb server application running and now run up the DVBViewer application again on the server PC the blue orb server application seems to draw out the channel information from DVBViewer.. but after about 30 seconds DVBViewer locks up and is inoperable (still not broadcasting at this point).. if I now insert the PIDs for the chosen channel into the blue orb server application, it springs into life and a TS is broadcast… Hm…however running up DVBViewer on the client PC using the chosen multicast address and port I get nothing… if I run up TS Reader I see a TS with PIDs VLC wont show any channels either, anyone ever tried the Blue orb server app and got it to multicast more than one channel with success? If so how (PID’s)??

 

Well this is the stage I’m at now and I need some help here guys, I can’t copy data for posting here as the customer has a confidentiality agreement with us… so anything I try will need to be drawn from the information I submit to you here..

 

With regards to application I have found the DVBViewer to be excellent quality… but need some help to expand it over the network.

 

I’ve also found some issues with Decoders and certain Codecs, but I now have a workable pack at the moment.

 

Comments anyone

 

Leadbelly

[leadbelly]

OK, this works guys, so if anyone wants to Multicast over a LAN or Intranet, then this is how it worked for a recent system I’ve installed.

 

First off, forget the plugin for DVBViewer…stream just 1 channel then ok its great… if you want to stream the entire bouquet (so far I’ve done 12 channels on 1 server) then here are some pointers on getting it working… To be honest this application is fantastic and well worth the 15 euros Christian is charging, my advice is buy it. The updates are worth this alone.

 

First off, I’ve set this up on a corporate LAN using gigabit fiber (installed by contractors) its extremely fast and has shit loads of spare bandwidth for this to work, I’ve tested it over wireless too and it varies depending on signal, switch traffic, email traffic, and well folks surfing.

 

I never managed to get the unicast operational… that said I never spent anymore than about 10 mins on it, I wanted Multicast… the idea of getting 30, 40, 50 channels over a network really appealed to me, and it worked after some tweaking.

 

Fundamental helps I used when you multicast from a server over a network use VLC to test it, (go google search VLC, download install, this application will play any MPG, AVI, even broken or partially downloaded movies & bit torrents!!)

 

 

OK back to DVBViewer, the address you use by default is 224.0.0.1 that’s fine don’t change anything it works, the port default 2345 that’s fine too… so if your using the plugin method for DVBViewer application, go to another PC on the network and install VLC, choose the network option (File, open) and use the multicast address for your server (224.0.0.1) and enter the port 2345, VLC should run up and you’ll have a video window.. check the XP firewall if your having issues. into the firewall and add the application as an exception.

 

Try installing a few MPEG-2 decoders.. just search google for MPEG2 decoders.

Got some.. I use 2, Moonlighting, an XP codec pack. But I have a PC with 6 installed, you can’t have too many!!! hell there free…

 

Install DVBViewer on a remote PC… open up the Direct-X section in DVBViewer and choose the multicast option under DVB Device, choose the same setup 224.0.0.1 port 2345 if you have dynamically downloaded the channels on the server, then save them and store them, on the remote PC erase all the satellite list and channels and import the list you just saved on the server (nice touch Christien)… open up your channel lists on the remote PC and go to the same channel that your multicasting on the server… it should bring you up the same channel… if not then select another decoder, play with this until it works, until you get this first bit operational, don’t proceed to the next multicast section.. keep checking that the server is sending the transport stream run up VLC, in fact I just left VLC open all the time because when I was configuring it the first week of testing

I had more bad conclusions over the fact that the server had fellen over 3 hours ago!!! and yes you can run both on the same PC (VLC & DVBViewer) at the same time…

 

If you get this bit operational, experiment a little, I notice that the best screen res was important for clarity.. Currently I have set up all the PC’s to 1280 X 1024, the graphics cards are not too important here, as far I can see, but I only tried out the NVIDIA and standard INTEL stuff (Dell GX250 and HP 7100s).

 

OK,, if your happy with that one channel and you want more, the DVBViewer and the plugin option your using will not work, well it never did with me nor on a colleagues LAN, I tried for days…maybe its my combo’s !! who cares…

 

Use the DVB Server application, this is located within the DVBViewer folder and looks like a little blue sphere… run it up on the server/pc (PC with DVB card) and take a look around it, what I found was this application seems to be dynamically linked, never had time to investigate how or by which DLLs needless to say if you follow this procedure it works each time, and its solid.. The 6 servers on my network run 24/7. I may get the odd drop out due to weather, but generally its solid week to week.

 

Additional pointers here, and important to understand, this blue sphere server broadcasts true TS output and by default over the same 224.0.0.1 leave this alone don’t **** with it..

 

All you need to do to this baby is add in the PIDs you want to stream for the channels on the bouquet you need… so for instance if your streaming a 3 channel transponder, on DVBViewer now.. open up the channel list and go to the next tab, this will give you all the channel info like frequency SR, FEC, and it will also give you the PIDs (program id’s) write them down on some paper (haven’t worked out how to dynamically transfer this so its paper and pencil job for now, enter into note pad for input later.

 

So now you have a list of the current PIDs from the transponder and the bouquet you want to multicast over your network…

 

On the server PC shut down the DVBViewer application, I’d carry out a restart just to be on the safe side here.. windows XP thing ain’t it!! And you’ve been opening and closing the DVB Server.. if you experience any funnies… restart the PC.

 

Run up DVBViewer, and open the channel you want to view, this should be the first channel in the list (must be this first channel or it wont work correctly)

DO NOT SHUT DVBViewer down.

Go into the DVBViewer folder and run up the DVB Server (blue sphere) upon the application running, DVBViewer will appear to crash and lock again don’t **** with it, just minimize it… you’ll also notice the server is STOPPED no broadcasts,

 

 

 

Move along the tabs until you come to the unicast/multicast section, on the drop down section choose multicast, again do not ***** any of these settings…on the tuning section you will notice that the application (blue sphere) has copied the current channel information over from DVBViewer, it should have the same frequency, SR, FEC etc. if not restart and go again…

 

I have my packet size set to 15000, you can increase this if you wish but it seems to be stable for me at this level. Taking the list of PIDs you now have and enter these into the Channel ID windows, when you have a few channel PIDs entered start the server up by pressing the start button.. Its ok to add the rest of the PIDs as you go, you can do this live with the server in running mode, I tested this by being remote into other PCs on the network and selecting a channel that’s not currently streaming… you’ll get a black screen, when you enter the Video PID and the Audio PID the channel starts up fine..

 

Well if you have followed this and I hope its clear enough, you should have a server running, broadcasting a TS with all the PIDs you need, you can do this on as many PCs as you want, the TS broadcast to the entire network as long as your running a flat VLAN, if your running mulit VLANS then the TS will not crossover… this was particularly good for me as I did not want to make this available to other network users (that were not in the building, corporate LAN)

 

Try to imagine the TS carrying the MPEG-2 in the form of packets, there identified by the PIDs, if you have 10 channles streaming, then you can have 50 users all watching that same channel, multicasting does not care, it simply spews it out… there is no error correction or formal checksums, hand shake resend requests… nowt… if your decoder got an error, you’ll have seen this as a patch work quilt type breakup, until the errors are cleared.

 

Bandwidth.. ok I’ve heard horrific stories about multicasting… things like Oh you’ll never broadcast 10 channels, or you network will get saturated… mail will stop and the AV applications wont like it, let alone the firewalls….

 

Bollocks, I’ve 6 servers running 5 channels each, and its metrics are around 8-10% bandwidth usage. As a rule of thumb each channel takes up around 1.8k/bits of network (Teletext and EPG take a fraction more) but if you don’t need teletext or an EPG then don’t broadcast it. (Leave the PID out). In fact just mulitcast the channels your needing.

 

Multicast is the way forward here and the quality is excellent, it should produce a DVD quality image, forget the usual Microsoft Bill Gates style media cast, this knocks the crap out of anything I have ever seen over a LAN… its so good I use it at home too. Give it a try.

 

If anyone needs any further help or pointers on this.. please I’ll be more than happy to add my comments…

 

Leadbelly

[demerzel]

Hi Leadbelly,

 

thats a great description.

I think i will try this (hopefully) in a view days.

 

Thanks a lot.

 

Hannes